A little twist on Irodov (Spring-pulley mechanics)

This is going to have a similar layout as problem 1.140 from Irodov. Consider the system below:

The origin of the system is at point A A . A bar A A rests on a horizontal plane and is connected to two weightless threads P A PA and, by means of a pulley, attached to a weight B B of the same mass as the bar. There is friction between bar A A and the plane it is on.

In addition, bar A A is connected to a spring hinged at point O O . At time t = 0 t = 0 , thread P A PA is burned, leaving the system to move. However, when the tension of the pulley thread exceeds 80 N 80\ \rm N of force, the pulley thread breaks and weight B B falls off, leaving no weight to pull on the bar.

Find the final stopping position of the bar, ie. the offset of the bar from the origin as declared above.

Relevant information:

  • The mass of bar A A and weight B B is 5 k g 5 \ \rm kg
  • The natural length of the spring l 0 = 2 m l_0 = 2\ \rm m
  • The spring constant k = 15 N / m k = 15\ \rm N/m
  • Gravitational acceleration g = 10 m / s 2 g = 10 \ \rm m/s^2
  • Coefficient of friction μ k = 0.2 \mu_k = 0.2


The answer is 1.1116.

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1 solution

Krishna Karthik
Oct 6, 2020

The original problem asks for the velocity of bar A A when it breaks off the plane. However, an energy conservation approach can't be used since there's friction as well as the tension, which has to be computed.

The two equations of motion that can be found using Newton's 2nd law.

The normal force acting on bar A A can be given by:

N = m g F s sin ( θ ) \bold{N} = mg - \bold{F}_s \sin(\theta)

The equation of motion for the movement of bar A A is:

m x ¨ = T ± μ N + F s cos ( θ ) m \ddot{x} = T \pm \mu \bold{N} + \bold{F}_{s} \cos(\theta)

Since tension is acting opposite to gravity, the equation of motion for weight B B is:

m x ¨ = m g T m \ddot{x} = mg - T

Rearranging the equation above for T T and substituting into the equation on top, we can find an equation for the acceleration:

x ¨ = m g ± μ N + F s cos ( θ ) 2 m \displaystyle \ddot{x} = \frac{mg \pm \mu \bold{N} + F_{s} \cos(\theta)}{2m}



The code for the simulation is given below:

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import math

time = 0
deltaT = 10**-5

#constants and initial values
l = 2
k = 15
m = 5
g = 10
mu = 0.20

tension = m*g

x = 0
xDot = 0

count = 0

while tension <= 80: #Stopping when tension = 80N; when the string breaks

  if count % 10000 == 0:
    print(time)

  #spring vector angle to horizontal
  cosTheta = x/(math.sqrt(x**2+l**2))
  sinTheta = l/(math.sqrt(x**2+l**2))

  #spring force magnitude
  springForce = k*(math.sqrt(x**2+l**2)-l)

  #horizontal and vertical components of spring force
  Fsy = springForce*sinTheta
  Fsx = -springForce*cosTheta

  normalForce = m*g-Fsy

  #friction force 
  if xDot > 0:
    frictionForce = -mu*normalForce
  else:
    frictionForce = mu*normalForce

  #finding acceleration using final Newtonian equation
  xDotDot = (m*g + frictionForce + Fsx)/(2*m)
  xDot += xDotDot*deltaT
  x += xDot*deltaT

  #magnitude of tension force solved using Newton's laws
  tension = abs(m*g-m*xDotDot)

  time += deltaT
  count += 1

count = 0

while time <= 40: #Large time period to find final stopping position
  #Altered equations of motion due to absence of pulley

  if count % 10000 == 0:
    print(time)

  cosTheta = x/(math.sqrt(x**2+l**2))
  sinTheta = l/(math.sqrt(x**2+l**2))

  springForce = k*(math.sqrt(x**2+l**2)-l)

  Fsy = springForce*sinTheta
  Fsx = -springForce*cosTheta

  normalForce = m*g-Fsy

  if xDot > 0:
    frictionForce = -mu*normalForce
  else:
    frictionForce = mu*normalForce

  #New equation of motion without pulley force
  xDotDot = (frictionForce + Fsx)/m
  xDot += xDotDot*deltaT
  x += xDot*deltaT


  time += deltaT
  count += 1

count = 0

Nice one. My graph looks exactly the same

Steven Chase - 8 months, 1 week ago

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Yeah; I might do some more twists on Irodov that require computer simulation soon. Thanks for solving.

Krishna Karthik - 8 months, 1 week ago

@Krishna Karthik WTF why are you making irodov questions bad, by converting them into simulation.
It is against the pride of Irodov's author.
Did you have solved all questions of mechanics using pen.??? Try to solve all good questions using pen.
If you don't have good and hard question .Tell me, I will give you hard questions. , which you have to solve using pen and paper only.


Talulah Riley - 8 months, 1 week ago

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@Talulah Riley I solved literally all questions up till Universal Gravitation; I started 2 weeks ago. By the way, I can extend a problem by making it harder if I want to.

Krishna Karthik - 8 months, 1 week ago

@Talulah Riley Were you the second solver of this problem? By the way, I still think it is as important to solve problems using numerical approaches rather than only pen and paper. With this problem, I doubt you can do analysis and still get the proper result, because of the nature of the system.

The numerical solution relied on my already good understanding of Newton's laws; the computer simply solves the equation you created in this problem.

Krishna Karthik - 8 months, 1 week ago

@Krishna Karthik Using python you can solve any question. That is not fair. You should know how to solve crictical mechanics using pen

Talulah Riley - 8 months, 1 week ago

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@Talulah Riley I solved this question by pen and paper. I don't think anything's wrong in extending a problem to make it more realistic and make it harder.

Krishna Karthik - 8 months, 1 week ago

@Krishna Karthik Irodov's author name is I.E Irodov. It takes him years to make such good questions.
And you are ruining his question by making some dirty changes and making it hard.

Talulah Riley - 8 months, 1 week ago

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@Talulah Riley Why is it wrong to play around with something; look at all the possibilities? In music, improvisation and theme and variation is encouraged. Why is it different for physics? Igor Irodov created these problems for individuals to gain a thorough understanding of the laws of mechanics. If you want to look at a simple exercise and find the laws of motion through Newtonian mechanics, why is it wrong to find a result for a similar but different phenomenon?

Solving problems and getting the answer is not the end-all. These problems are designed to illustrate the different ways in which the laws of motion work.

In fact, if you're an engineer, this is the more realistic system to analyse. When given the tension threshold of a thread and friction, one must know how the system should play out. You should look at different ways to solve a problem; the energy conservation way was already done; now it's time for Newtonian method.

Krishna Karthik - 8 months, 1 week ago

@Krishna Karthik No problem. I was just sharing my opinion. Do whatever you want. Cheers :)

Talulah Riley - 8 months, 1 week ago

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Alright; no problem. I'll keep doing this for interesting Irodov problems, as well as showing a solution to the original problem.

Krishna Karthik - 8 months, 1 week ago

Nicely done.

Karan Chatrath - 8 months, 1 week ago

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Thanks for your help mate :)

Krishna Karthik - 8 months, 1 week ago

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