Sequential roots

Algebra Level 4

a , b a, b and c c are positive real numbers satisfying a + b + c = 100 a + b + c = 100 . The maximum value of

a + a b + a b c 3 a + \sqrt{ab} + \sqrt[3]{abc}

can be expressed as m n \dfrac{m}{n} , where m m and n n are coprime positive integers. What is the value of m + n m+n ?


The answer is 403.

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11 solutions

C Lim
Sep 29, 2013

By the AM-GM inequality , we have:

a + 4 b 2 a 4 b a b a + 4 b 4 , a + 4 b + 16 c 3 a 4 b 16 c 3 a b c 3 a + 4 b + 16 c 12 . \begin{aligned} \frac{a + 4b} 2 &\ge \sqrt{a\cdot 4b}\implies \sqrt{ab} \le \frac{a+4b} 4,\\ \frac{a+4b+16c} 3 & \ge \sqrt[3]{a\cdot 4b\cdot 16c} \implies \sqrt[3]{abc} \le \frac{a+4b+16c}{12}.\end{aligned}

Adding these two equations together and an a a to both sides, we get:

a + a b + a b c 3 4 3 ( a + b + c ) = 400 3 . a + \sqrt{ab} + \sqrt[3]{abc} \le \frac 4 3 (a+b+c) = \frac{400} 3.

Voila!

From the second equation, equality case holds at a = 4 b = 16 c . a=4b=16c.

For some inspiration on how to discover this approach, check out Anqi Li's solution.

Great solution!

I was wondering if there is way to solve it using Cauchy-Schwarz inequality. From AM-GM,

a + a b + a b c 3 11 a + 5 b + 2 c 6 a+\sqrt{ab}+\sqrt[3]{abc} \leq \frac{11a+5b+2c}{6} .

From Cauchy-Schwarz,

( 11 a + 5 b + 2 c ) 2 ( a 2 + b 2 + c 2 ) ( 150 ) (11a+5b+2c)^2 \leq (a^2+b^2+c^2)(150) .

Is there a way to proceed from this step?

Any help is appreciated. Thanks!

Pranav Arora - 7 years, 8 months ago

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i can't proceed with it as sum of a, b, c is constant and Not sum of their squares. Even otherwise, your first equality occurs for a:b:c = 1:1:1 and second one for 11:5:2....so i wonder how to solve even if sum of squares of a, b, c were given constant..?? Again, admire help..gratitude in advance. :)

Piyushkumar Palan - 7 years, 8 months ago

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In fact the only way I can see to relate a 2 + b 2 + c 2 a^2 + b^2 + c^2 to a + b + c a+b+c is to use QM-AM but that gives us the bound in the wrong direction :-/ hopefully someone can perhaps shed some light on this :)

Anqi Li - 7 years, 8 months ago

How did you know that you need to take a + 4 b 2 \frac{a+4b}{2} while taking AM-GM. Should we take a + b 2 \frac{a+b}{2}

Kumar Ashutosh - 7 years, 8 months ago

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Kumar, nice question :) Maybe you would like to see my solution for the motivation of these "strange" coefficients?

Anqi Li - 7 years, 8 months ago

What if a=b=c=100/3 ? Then the value would be even smaller.

Aparna Roy - 4 years, 4 months ago

what is that a+4b/2 from? why not a+b/2

sx Z - 11 months ago

i read all 4 solutions but no one actually mention the part which leads to a=4b=16c, it's quite hard to solve though.

Cuong Doan - 7 years, 8 months ago
Anqi Li
Oct 1, 2013

Since this is an inequality question and there are square (and cube) roots in the question, one natural method to use is AM-GM .

My first instinct was to use AM-GM directly on the roots: a + a b + a b c 3 a + a + b 2 + a + b + c 3 . a + \sqrt{ab} + \sqrt[3]{abc}\le a + \frac{a+b}{2}+ \frac{a+b+c}{3}. This means that I want to minimize b b and c . c. However, they cannot be 0 since then the product would be 0 and the expression is minimized, instead of maximized and so we are stuck.

Conclusion: we cannot just use AM-GM directly.

Next, I tried something else:

By AM-GM, we have a b a + b 2 \sqrt{ab} \le \frac{a+b}{2} , which is equivalent to 2 a b a + b 2 \sqrt{ab} \le a+b and similarly 3 a b c 3 a + b + c . 3\sqrt[3]{abc} \le a + b + c. With this in mind, we try to write a b \sqrt{ab} and a b c 3 \sqrt[3]{abc} in the given expression as 2 a x × b y 2\sqrt{\frac{a}{x} \times\frac{b}{y}} and 3 a k × b m × c n 3 3\sqrt[3]{\frac{a}{k} \times \frac{b}{m} \times \frac{c}{n}} , respectively (where x × y = 4 x \times y = 4 and k × m × n = 27 k \times m \times n = 27 ), so that from AM-GM we have that a + 2 a x × b y + 3 a k × b m × c n 3 a + a x + b y + a k + b m + c n . a + 2 \sqrt{\frac{a}{x} \times \frac{b}{y}} + 3 \sqrt[3]{ \frac{a}{k} \times \frac{b}{m} \times \frac{c}{n}} \le a + \frac{a}{x} + \frac{b}{y}+ \frac{a}{k} + \frac{b}{m}+ \frac{c}{n}.

The reason we do this is because we are given the value of a + b + c a + b + c , so if we can choose values of x , y , k , m , n x, y, k, m, n such that the RHS is a multiple of a + b + c a + b + c , then we can find a maximum for the given expression. Then we need the coefficients of a , b , c a, b, c to be equal to each other: in other words, 1 + 1 x + 1 k = 1 y + 1 m = 1 n . 1 + \frac{1}{x} + \frac{1}{k} = \frac{1}{y} + \frac{1}{m}= \frac{1}{n} .

Given that x × y = 4 x \times y = 4 and k × m × n = 27 , k \times m \times n =27, to make life easier, we can set x = 4 x = 4 and y = 1 y = 1 so that 1 = 1 / y 1 = 1/y , which changes the equation to 1 4 + 1 k = 1 m = 1 n 1. \frac{1}{4} + \frac{1}{k} = \frac{1}{m} = \frac{1}{n} - 1.

To help, in order for the maximum to even be achievable, both of the AM-GM inequalities need to hold, meaning that a x = b y \frac{a}{x} = \frac{b}{y} and a k = b m = c n \frac{a}{k} = \frac{b}{m} = \frac{c}{n} . But this means that x y = a b = k m \frac{x}{y} = \frac{a}{b} = \frac{k}{m} , so we need to have k m = 4 1 = 4 \frac{k}{m} = \frac{4}{1} = 4 , or k = 4 m k = 4m . Then since we also need 1 4 + 1 k = 1 m \frac{1}{4} + \frac{1}{k} = \frac{1}{m} , we can see that 1 4 = 3 4 m \frac{1}{4} = \frac{3}{4m} , or m = 3 m = 3 . Then this gives k = 12 k = 12 and n = 4 3 n = \frac{4}{3} .

Hence we have (due to AM - GM): a + 2 a 4 × b + 3 a 12 × b 3 × 4 c 3 3 a + a 4 + a 12 + b 3 + 4 c 3 a + 2 \sqrt{ \frac{a}{4} \times b} + 3 \sqrt[3]{\frac{a}{12} \times \frac{b}{3} \times \frac{4c}{3}} \le a + \frac{a}{4} + \frac{a}{12} + \frac{b}{3}+ \frac{4c}{3} = 4 3 × ( a + b + c ) , \frac{4}{3} \times (a+b+c), with equality achieved when a 4 = b \frac{a}{4} = b and a 12 = b 3 = 4 c 3 \frac{a}{12} = \frac{b}{3} = \frac{4c}{3} , which happens when a = 160 21 , b = 40 21 a = \frac{160}{21}, b = \frac{40}{21} and c = 10 21 c = \frac{10}{21} .

Putting this into the context of the question, we get the maximum is m n = 4 3 × ( a + b + c ) = 4 3 × 100 = 400 3 . \frac{m}{n}= \frac{4}{3} \times (a + b + c) = \frac{4}{3} \times 100 = \frac{400}{3} . Hence, m + n = 403. m+n = 403.

Although this can be greatly simplified, I think it is better to share my thoughts and motivations.

Great explanation of your first instinct. I knew that was what most people would attempt too, and get stuck. Glad to see that you can push through, and even provide a reasonable explanation for the choice of 'strange' coefficients used lated.

I agree that it was wise of you to share your thoughts and motivations, and I see that several other people agree too. Keep it up!

Calvin Lin Staff - 7 years, 8 months ago

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agree...thanks

Piyushkumar Palan - 7 years, 8 months ago

Sir it took 10-11 minutes to solve this question and maximum 25 minutes for your high level questions but I don't know why I usually see median time to solve tough questions over 45-200 minutes!

Department 8 - 5 years, 6 months ago

I can't seem to get why Anqi arbitrarily set x = 4 x=4 and y = 1 y=1 . We have a system of 5 5 equations and 5 5 variables, so did she just get lucky and guess the solution correctly?

Daniel Liu - 5 years, 5 months ago

I'm sorry I meant set y = 1 y = 1

Anqi Li - 7 years, 8 months ago

And I also forgot to mention that equality holds when a = 4 b = 16 c a = 4b = 16c :P

Anqi Li - 7 years, 8 months ago

Thanks, great writeup. It seems the key point is that we want to make an AM-GM where (a+b+c) appears on the AM side , as opposed to trying to substitute out one of the variables.

Matt McNabb - 7 years, 8 months ago

Hey, somewhere half the way in the solution, I think you switched the signs. It should've been a + 2 a / x × b / y + 3 a / k × b / m × c / n 3 a + a / x + b / y + a / k + b / m + c / n a + 2\sqrt{ a/x \times b/y } + 3\sqrt[3]{ a/k \times b/m \times c/n} \le a + a/x + b/y + a/k + b/m + c/n . That is, \le and not \ge

Also, in the line where you mention k = 12 , m = 3 , n = 4 / 3 k = 12, m = 3, n = 4/3 , the value of n n over there must be 3 / 4 3/4 .

One more thing: The ratio should've been k : m : n = 16 : 4 : 1 k:m:n = 16:4:1

But on the whole, SIMPLY AWESOME EXPLANATION!

Parth Thakkar - 7 years, 8 months ago

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Yup thanks for pointing out the typos :)

Anqi Li - 7 years, 8 months ago

I always search for this kind of solution, i very appreciate you for sharing your motivation!!

Azzam Labib - 3 years, 8 months ago

Excellent one..beautiful

Soumyadeep Gope - 1 month, 4 weeks ago

long solution

Anubhav Singh - 7 years, 8 months ago
Shivang Jindal
Sep 29, 2013

Lemma

Let a , b , c a,b,c be the positive real numbers . Then a + a b + a b c 3 4 ( a + b + c ) 3 a+\sqrt{ab}+\sqrt[3]{abc} \le \frac{4(a+b+c)}{3} holds . Equality when a = 4 b = 16 c a=4b=16c

Proof

a + a b + a b c 3 = a + 2 a 4 . b + 3 a 12 . b 3 . 4 c 3 3 a+\sqrt{ab}+\sqrt[3]{abc}=a+2\sqrt{\frac{a}{4}.b}+3\sqrt[3]{\frac{a}{12}.\frac{b}{3}.\frac{4c}{3}} Using AM-GM inequality , a + 2 a 4 . b + 3 a 12 . b 3 . 4 c 3 3 a + a 4 + b + a 12 + b 3 + 4 c 3 a+2\sqrt{\frac{a}{4}.b}+3\sqrt[3]{\frac{a}{12}.\frac{b}{3}.\frac{4c}{3}} \le a+\frac{a}{4}+b+\frac{a}{12}+\frac{b}{3}+\frac{4c}{3} Which is equal to 4 3 ( a + b + c ) \frac{4}{3}(a+b+c) . which completes the proof of lemma .. inequality holds when a 12 = b 3 = 4 c 3 a = 4 b = 16 c \frac{a}{12} = \frac{b}{3} = \frac{4c}{3} \implies a=4b=16c \Box .

So using the lemma , we have

a + a b + a b c 3 4 ( 100 ) 3 = 400 3 a+\sqrt{ab}+\sqrt[3]{abc} \le \frac{4(100)}{3} = \frac{400}{3} So maximum value is 400 3 \frac{400}{3} Thus m + n = 403 m+n=403 \Box

Awesome..

Kishan k - 7 years, 7 months ago
Tahsin Saffat
Sep 30, 2013

Let a + b + c = S a+b+c=S . Note that by AM-GM inequality,

a b 1 2 a + 2 b 2 \sqrt{ab} \leq \frac{\frac{1}{2}a+2b}{2}

a b c 3 1 4 a + b + 4 c 3 \sqrt[3]{abc} \leq \frac{\frac{1}{4}a+b+4c}{3}

Combining these, we have a + a b + a b c 3 4 3 S a+\sqrt{ab}+\sqrt[3]{abc} \leq \frac{4}{3}S . Further, we can verify that equality occurs at ( a , b , c ) = ( 16 21 S , 4 21 S , 1 21 S ) (a,b,c)=(\frac{16}{21}S,\frac{4}{21}S,\frac{1}{21}S) . Hence, the answer is 4 3 S = 400 3 \frac{4}{3}S=\boxed{\frac{400}{3}} .

By using Cauchy inequality, we have:

a 2 + 2 b 2 a b \frac{a}{2}+2b \geq 2 \sqrt{ab}

a 4 + b + 4 c 3 a b c 3 \frac{a}{4}+b+4c \geq 3 \sqrt[3]{abc} .

Therefore, a + a b + a b c 3 4 3 ( a + b + c ) a+\sqrt{ab}+\sqrt[3]{abc} \leq \frac{4}{3} (a+b+c) .

Therefore, a + a b + a b c 3 a+\sqrt{ab}+\sqrt[3]{abc} max = 400 3 \frac{400}{3} when a 4 = b = 4 c = 400 21 \frac{a}{4}=b=4c=\frac{400}{21} .

The answer is: 400+3=403.

it's AM-GM not Cauchy

Cuong Doan - 7 years, 8 months ago

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The AM-GM inequality is attributed to Cauchy.

Igmut Schnoll - 7 years, 8 months ago

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This may be a debatable fine point. Cauchy certainly provided a proof of the AM-GM inequality. Primacy of discovery is not always clear for mathematical theorems. I jokingly say, "In mathematics, theorems are named after their most recent discoverer."

Igmut Schnoll - 7 years, 8 months ago
Sagnik Saha
Jan 30, 2014

This solution was possible only after help from Sreejato Bhattacharya. Since a , b , c a,b,c are positive reals, we have

a + 4 b 2 2 a b \dfrac{a + 4b}{2} \geq 2\sqrt{ab} \implies a + 4 b 4 a b \dfrac{a + 4b}{4} \geq \sqrt{ab}

Again, a + 4 b + 16 c 3 4 a b c 3 \dfrac{a + 4b + 16c}{3} \geq 4\sqrt[3]{abc} \implies a + 4 b + 16 c 12 a b c 3 \dfrac{a + 4b + 16c}{12} \geq \sqrt[3]{abc}

Adding, we get,

a + 4 b 4 + a + 4 b + 16 c 12 a b + a b c 3 \dfrac{a + 4b}{4} + \dfrac{a + 4b + 16c}{12} \geq \sqrt{ab} + \sqrt[3]{abc}

Simplification of L.H.S leads to

4 a + 16 b + 16 c 12 a b + a b c 3 \dfrac{4a + 16b + 16c}{12} \geq \sqrt{ab} + \sqrt[3]{abc} . Adding a to both sides

a + 4 a + 16 b + 16 c 12 a + a b + a b c 3 a + \dfrac{4a + 16b + 16c}{12} \geq a + \sqrt{ab} + \sqrt[3]{abc}

\implies 16 ( a + b + c ) 12 a + a b + a b c 3 \dfrac{16(a+b+c)}{12} \geq a + \sqrt{ab} + \sqrt[3]{abc}

Thus, a + a b + a b c 3 4 3 × 100 = 400 3 a + \sqrt{ab} + \sqrt[3]{abc} \leq \dfrac{4}{3} \times 100 = \boxed{\dfrac{400}{3}}

You also have to show that equality occurs.

Sreejato Bhattacharya - 7 years, 4 months ago

What level would you say these problems are at? Close to national math olympiads, or higher than this

Yash Patel - 7 years, 4 months ago

equality occurs when a = 4 b = 16 c a=4b=16c . The values can easily be computed using a + b + c = 100 a+b+c=100 .

Sagnik Saha - 7 years, 4 months ago

Applying the AM-GM inequality, we have:

a + a b + a b c 3 a+\sqrt{ab}+\sqrt[3]{abc}

= a + 1 2 a . 4 b + 1 4 a . 4 b . 16 c 3 \displaystyle =a+\frac{1}{2}{a.4b}+\frac{1}{4}\sqrt[3]{a.4b.16c}

a + a + 4 b 4 + a + 4 b + 16 c 12 \displaystyle \leq a+\frac{a+4b}{4}+\frac{a+4b+16c}{12}

= 4 3 ( a + b + c ) = 400 3 \displaystyle =\frac{4}{3}(a+b+c)=\frac{400}{3}

The equality occurs iff a = 1600 21 , b = 400 21 , c = 100 21 \displaystyle a=\frac{1600}{21},b=\frac{400}{21},c=\frac{100}{21}

So m + n = 403 m+n=\boxed{403}

Jon Haussmann
Sep 29, 2013

Let x = a / 16 x = a/16 , y = b / 4 y = b/4 , and z = c z = c , so a = 16 x a = 16x , b = 4 y b = 4y , and c = z c = z . Then the given condition a + b + c = 100 a + b + c = 100 becomes 16 x + 4 y + z = 100 16x + 4y + z = 100 . We want to maximize $$a + \sqrt{ab} + \sqrt[3]{abc} = 16x + 8 \sqrt{xy} + 4 \sqrt[3]{xyz}.$$

By the AM-GM inequality, x y ( x + y ) / 2 \sqrt{xy} \le (x + y)/2 and x y z 3 ( x + y + z ) / 3 \sqrt[3]{xyz} \le (x + y + z)/3 , so

16 x + 8 x y + 4 x y z 3 16 x + 4 ( x + y ) + 4 3 ( x + y + z ) = 4 3 ( 16 x + 4 y + z ) = 400 3 . \begin{aligned} 16x + 8 \sqrt{xy} + 4 \sqrt[3]{xyz} &\le 16x + 4(x + y) + \frac{4}{3} (x + y + z) \\ &= \frac{4}{3} (16x + 4y + z) \\ &= \frac{400}{3}. \end{aligned}

Equality occurs when x = y = z = 100 / 21 x = y = z = 100/21 , so the maximum value is 400/3.

Because a , b , c > 0 a,b,c>0 , by A.M.-G.M. inequality we get

a + a b + a b c 3 = a + a 4 b 2 + a 4 b 16 c 3 4 a+\sqrt{ab}+\sqrt[3]{abc} = a+\frac{\sqrt{a \cdot 4b}}{2}+\frac{\sqrt[3]{a \cdot 4b \cdot 16c}}{4} .

a + 1 2 a + 4 b 2 + 1 4 a + 4 b + 16 c 3 \le a+\frac{1}{2}\cdot\frac{a+4b}{2}+\frac{1}{4}\cdot\frac{a+4b+16c}{3}

16 a + 16 b + 16 c 12 \le \frac{16a+16b+16c}{12}

400 3 \le \frac{400}{3}

Therefore, since gcd ( 400 , 3 ) = 1 \gcd(400,3)=1 , the answer is 400 + 3 = 403 400+3=403 .

Huân Lê Quang
Jun 8, 2016

Apply the AM-GM inequality:

a b = ( a x ) ( b x ) a x + b x 2 = 1 2 x a + x 2 b a b c 3 = ( a y ) ( b z ) ( c y z ) 3 a y + b z + c y z 3 = 1 3 y a + 1 3 z b + y z 3 c a + a b + a b c 3 ( 1 + 1 2 x + 1 3 y ) a + ( x 2 + 1 3 z ) b + y z 3 c ( ) \sqrt { ab } =\sqrt { \left( \frac { a }{ x } \right) (bx) } \le \frac { \frac { a }{ x } +bx }{ 2 } =\frac { 1 }{ 2x } a+\frac { x }{ 2 } b\\ \\ \sqrt [ 3 ]{ abc } =\sqrt [ 3 ]{ \left( \frac { a }{ y } \right) \left( \frac { b }{ z } \right) (cyz) } \le \frac { \frac { a }{ y } +\frac { b }{ z } +cyz }{ 3 } =\frac { 1 }{ 3y } a+\frac { 1 }{ 3z } b+\frac { yz }{ 3 } c\\ \\ \Rightarrow \quad a+\sqrt { ab } +\sqrt [ 3 ]{ abc } \le \left( 1+\frac { 1 }{ 2x } +\frac { 1 }{ 3y } \right) a+\left( \frac { x }{ 2 } +\frac { 1 }{ 3z } \right) b+\frac { yz }{ 3 } c\quad \quad (*)\\ where x , y , z > 0 x,y,z>0

However, because the only given data we have is a + b + c = 100 a+b+c=100 , our goal is to find a positive constant k k such that a + a b + a b c 3 k ( a + b + c ) = k a + k b + k c a+\sqrt { ab } +\sqrt [ 3 ]{ abc } \le \quad k(a+b+c)\quad =\quad ka+kb+kc .

So, try to set 1 + 1 2 x + 1 3 y = x 2 + 1 3 z = y z 3 1+\frac { 1 }{ 2x } +\frac { 1 }{ 3y } =\frac { x }{ 2 } +\frac { 1 }{ 3z } =\frac { yz }{ 3 } . This yields a very beautiful and comfortable solution: x = 2 , y = 4 , z = 1 x=2,y=4,z=1 .

Plug in again to the inequality ( ) (*) :

a + ( a 2 ) ( 2 b ) + ( a 4 ) ( b 1 ) ( 4 c ) 3 = a + a b + a b c 3 4 3 a + 4 3 b + 4 3 c = 400 3 a+\sqrt { \left( \frac { a }{ 2 } \right) (2b) } +\quad \sqrt [ 3 ]{ \left( \frac { a }{ 4 } \right) \left( \frac { b }{ 1 } \right) (4c) } =a+\sqrt { ab } +\sqrt [ 3 ]{ abc } \le \frac { 4 }{ 3 } a+\frac { 4 }{ 3 } b+\frac { 4 }{ 3 } c=\frac { 400 }{ 3 } .

Equality happen when: a 2 = 2 b a n d a 4 = b = 4 c a n d a + b + c = 100 a = 1600 21 ; b = 400 21 ; c = 100 21 \frac { a }{ 2 } =2b\quad and\quad \frac { a }{ 4 } =b=4c\quad and\quad a+b+c=100\\ \Rightarrow \quad a=\frac { 1600 }{ 21 } ;b=\frac { 400 }{ 21 } ;c=\frac { 100 }{ 21 }

Moderator note:

Great approach. It is not immediately apparent why the approach would work, and we are mostly hoping that there are variables which allow for it to work out.

Anca Baltariga
Jan 23, 2016

This is my solution!

Always remember that to show you actually have the maximum , you need to show that equality can exist. Otherwise, all that you have is an upper bound.

For example, it is clear that x 2 0 , ( x + 1 ) 2 0 - x^2 \leq 0 , - ( x + 1) ^2 \leq 0 . However, the maximium of x 2 ( x + 1 ) 2 -x^2 - (x+1)^2 is not 0 + 0 = 0 0 + 0 = 0 . In this case, we only have an upper bound, but it is not the lowest upper bound .

Calvin Lin Staff - 5 years, 4 months ago

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