Creating clues to a safe

Logic Level 5

A certain safe has a four digit combination code. Any digit 0-9 may be used and digits may appear more than once. Having been told the code, you are tasked with creating a set of clues to allow someone to deduce the code. Your clues must meet the following conditions:

  • All clues must be true.
  • Given all the clues, it must be possible to determine the correct code.
  • No clues can be redundant. That is, if any clue is removed, it is no longer possible to determine the correct code.
  • Clues may not refer to the number of clues.

You may assume that anyone attempting to deduce the code is a perfect logician. Given these conditions, what is the longest list of clues you can create? If the list of clues can be arbitrarily long, enter 0.


The answer is 9999.

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2 solutions

David Vreken
Dec 20, 2018

The list of clues can be "1) The code is not 0000 0000 , 2) the code is not 0001 0001 , 3) the code is not 0002 0002 " and so on, skipping over the actual code itself.

As there are 1 0 4 = 10000 10^4 = 10000 four digit combination codes, the logician would be required to have all 10000 1 = 9999 10000 - 1 = \boxed{9999} clues to deduce the missing one.

Any clue list with 10000 10000 clues or more must have a redundant clue, so this is the longest list of clues that can be created.

problem is too vague. simple thinking certainly helps.

Srikanth Tupurani - 2 years, 5 months ago

I'm certain this can go through infinity (we can stop at any point we want), we can change it into a one time pad thing. a ^ 3 = ... a ^ 5 = ... a ^ ... = ... without having a^a, and skipping all 1<<k, can you disprove this :) ?

A Steven Kusuman - 2 years, 5 months ago

Can This Be done through Information Theory ?

V i S i o N . - 2 years, 5 months ago

The clue list doesn't have to be in the form of "it's not 0000, it's not 0001 ... ". There're infinite no. of ways to formulate an infinitely long list of clues. One immediate e.g that came to me is detailed below.

weiming zheng - 1 year, 8 months ago
Weiming Zheng
Sep 19, 2019

9999 was my initial answer. But on 2nd thought, I think it's 0.

The clue list doesn't have to be in the form of "it's not 0000, it's not 0001 ... ". E.g., it can be a list of eqn's like this one: Let X1 (the code), X2, ..., Xn be n unknowns, & c(1,1), ... c(jk), ..., & A1, .. An are known constants. I can write sth like:

c(1,1)•X1 + c(1,2)•X2 + ... + c(1,k)•Xk = A1
c(2,1)•X1 + c(2,2)•X2 + ... + c(2,k)•Xk + c(2,k+1)•Xk+1 = A2
c(3,1)•X1 + c(3,2)•X2 + ... + c(3,k)•Xk + c(3,k+1)•Xk+1 + c(3,k+2)•Xk+2 = A3
......
c(n,1)•X1 + c(n,2)•X2 + ... + c(n,k)•Xk + c(n,k+1)•Xk+1 + c(n,k+2)•Xk+2 + ... + c(n,n)•Xn = An
...

Solving n eqn's w/ n unknowns reveals the code X1. When n -> ∞, w/ each eqn being a clue, the clue list can be arbitrarily long. This is just one e.g. It's obvious that there're also infinite no. of ways to formulate these arbitrarily long clue lists.

I agree with you. The answer should be 0. Look at the clues: 1) ans = x 2) x = y 3) y = z .. .. m) z = 1111

It takes all m clues to solve the problem. None of the clues are redundant. m can be made arbitrarily large.

Eshan Balachandar - 1 year, 6 months ago

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Thank u Eshan - u made my day. BTW, I like the simplicity of the e.g u use in ur proof.

weiming zheng - 1 year, 6 months ago

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