Hyperloop: Dropping coins

The Hyperloop is a hypothetical new fast transport system between cities, which works by launching pods that carry people through a very low air pressure tunnel. While riding in the Hyperloop, some coins fall out of your pocket, taking 1/3 of a second to hit the ground. How much more quickly would the coins have hit the ground if you were sitting still in seconds ?

Details and assumptions

  • The radius of the earth is 6370 km 6370~\mbox{km} .
  • The Hyperloop travels at 300 m/s 300~\mbox{m/s} .
  • When sitting still relative to the Earth's surface, acceleration toward the Earth is 9.8 m/s 2 -9.8~\mbox{m/s}^2 .


The answer is 0.00024.

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2 solutions

John Roster
Aug 20, 2013

The hyper-loop will have a centripetal acceleration of 9.8m/ s 2 s^{2} + 30 0 2 6370000 m \frac{300^{2}}{6370000m} .Using motion equation you get distance traveled in 1/3 of a second for that particular centripetal acceleration to be 0.545m.Again using motion equation you get the time taken to be 0.3335,giving you an edge of 0.000238

EDITED 27-Aug Initially I had t t and t 1 t_1 the wrong way around, and added extra explanation.

We are trying to find out the effect of the pod's centripetal acceleration on the coin falling time. The assumption is made that the pod is moving parallel to the earth, so it experiences an apparent centrifugal force of m v 2 r \frac{mv^2}{r} .

So the effective gravity in the pod will be g 1 = g 30 0 2 6370000 g_1 = g - \frac{300^2}{6370000} .

Let t t be the time the coin takes to fall under gravity g g , and t 1 = 1 3 t_1 = \frac{1}{3} be the time the coin takes to fall under the apparent gravity g 1 g_1 .

The distance is the same in both cases, so

1 2 g t 2 = 1 2 g 1 ( 1 3 ) 2 \frac{1}{2}gt^2 = \frac{1}{2}g_1{(\frac{1}{3})}^2

Rearranging this gives :

t 2 = ( 1 3 ) 2 g 1 g t^2 = {(\frac{1}{3})}^2 \frac{g_1}{g} so t = 1 3 g 1 g t = \frac{1}{3}\sqrt{\frac{g_1}{g}} so t 1 t = 1 3 ( 1 g 1 g ) t_1 - t = \frac{1}{3}(1 - \sqrt{\frac{g_1}{g}})

Numerically we get g 1 = 9.78587... g_1 = 9.78587... , g 1 g = 0.998558... \frac{g_1}{g} = 0.998558... , and t 1 t = 2.4037116... 1 0 4 t_1 - t = 2.4037116... *10^{-4}

Matt McNabb - 7 years, 9 months ago

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Also it took me like half an hour to figure out that this was what they wanted. At first I thought the problem was to find how much longer the coin took to fall due to the fact that the track runs parallel to the Earth's surface, and the track has fallen away somewhat due to the curvature of the Earth (the coin would continue in a straight line instead of following the curvature).

Matt McNabb - 7 years, 9 months ago

Just a detail: g g and g 1 g_1 should be swapped. For 1/3 sec is measured in the Hyperloop frame...

Luciano Riosa - 7 years, 9 months ago

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Thanks, I have edited my post to fix this.

Matt McNabb - 7 years, 9 months ago

Can you explain more complete please... i did'nt understad from begin where you got g 1 = g 30 0 2 / 6370000 g1=g- 300^2 / 6370000

Hafizh Ahsan Permana - 7 years, 9 months ago

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What they want to know is how the centripetal acceleration of the train affects the coin. We're assuming the train is on a track that is parallel to the surface of the Earth. So if the train moves with speed v v then it is actually accelerating towards the centre of the Earth at rate m v 2 / r mv^2/r . This means that in the reference frame of the pod there is an apparent force of m v 2 / r mv^2/r directed upwards (i.e. centrifugal force). So the total force on the coin is g g downwards and m v 2 / r mv^2/r upwards, for a net force of g m v 2 / r g - mv^2/r .

Matt McNabb - 7 years, 9 months ago

I know that centripetal acceleration is equal to v^2/r, but why are you adding the acceleration to gravity to that? Can you also tell me the motion equation?

Revanth Gumpu - 7 years, 9 months ago

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I think John must be missing a sign. The centripetal acceleration is in the opposite direction of the acceleration of gravity so the net acceleration will be less on the Hyperloop. The motion equation is x = x 0 + v 0 t + 1 2 a t 2 x = x_0 + v_0t + \frac 12at^2

Anthony Clark - 7 years, 9 months ago

In this problem are unfortunately neglected the rotational speed of the Earth (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravitational_acceleration) and the "course" of the pod, which are both basically needed to solve the question.

Skipping the computation I did, I think I could say, for example, that:

supposing, for simplicity, the Hyperloop lies on the equator ,

  • and the pod is directed eastwards , the answer would be 0.001 sec

  • and the pod is directed westwards the answer would be - 0.0005 sec.

It is worth noting that this differences are progressively higher with higher latitudes values.

Luciano Riosa - 7 years, 9 months ago
Zak Marcone
Aug 23, 2013

Using the formula a = v^2/r one can calculate the centrifugal acceleration of the coins. The true acceleration experienced by the coins would be 9.8 - a as gravity pulls the coins to the earth. Using this acceleration one can calculate for the distance fallen using the formula d = vit+0.5at^2, where vi is the initial velocity in the y-direction. One can then calculate the time necessary for an object at rest to fall that distance using d = vit+0.5 9.8 t^2. The final answer is the difference: (1/3) - t.

The steps with the actual numbers are shown below:

a = 300^2/(6370000) = 0.014128...

9.8 - 0.01428... = 9.78587...

d = 0 (1/3)+9.78587... (1/3)^2 = 0.54366...

0.54366... = 0 t+9.8 t^2 = 0.33309...

(1/3) - 0.33309... = 2.40*10^-4

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