Việt's polynomial

Algebra Level 5

Suppose that α = 3 5 7 + 5 3 7 \alpha = \sqrt[7]{\frac{3}{5}} + \sqrt[7]{\frac{5}{3}} is a root of the 7th degree polynomial f ( x ) f(x) which has integer coefficients and a leading coefficient of 15 - 15 . What is the value of f ( 1 ) f(1) ?

This problem is posed by Việt L.


The answer is 19.

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11 solutions

C Lim
May 20, 2014

First we'll show that if y = x + 1 x y = x + \frac 1 x , then a n : = x n + 1 x n a_n := x^n + \frac 1 {x^n} can be expressed as a polynomial in y of degree n, for n=1,2,3, ... .

For that, let T 2 a T + b = 0 T^2 - aT + b = 0 be the quadratic equation with roots x and 1/x. Then b = x 1 x = 1 b = x\cdot \frac 1 x = 1 and a = y a = y . Since the quadratic equation has roots x and 1/x, we have:

x 2 y x + 1 = 0 , ( 1 / x ) 2 y ( 1 / x ) + 1 = 0 x^2 - yx + 1 = 0, \quad (1/x)^2 - y(1/x) + 1 = 0 .

Multiplying the first equation by x n x^n and the second by x n x^{-n} , we get:

x n + 2 y x n + 1 + x n = 0 , ( 1 / x ) n + 2 y ( 1 / x ) n + 1 + ( 1 / x ) n = 0 x^{n+2} - yx^{n+1} + x^n = 0, \quad (1/x)^{n+2} - y(1/x)^{n+1} + (1/x)^n = 0 .

Adding them together gives us a n + 2 = y a n + 1 a n = y a n + 1 a n a_{n+2} = y\cdot a_{n+1} - a_n = y\cdot a_{n+1} - a_n . Starting from a 0 = 2 , a 1 = y a_0 = 2, a_1 = y , we get:

a 2 = y 2 2 , a 3 = y 3 3 y , , a 7 = y ( y 6 7 y 4 + 14 y 2 7 ) . a_2 = y^2 - 2, a_3 = y^3 - 3y, \ldots, a_7 = y(y^6 - 7y^4 +14y^2 -7).

Hence, for x = 3 5 7 x = \sqrt[7]{\frac 3 5} , we have α = y \alpha = y and

α ( α 6 7 α 4 + 14 α 2 7 ) = 3 5 + 5 3 = 34 15 . \alpha(\alpha^6 - 7\alpha^4 + 14\alpha^2 - 7) = \frac 3 5 + \frac 5 3 = \frac{34}{15}.

This gives a rational polynomial of degree 7 for which α \alpha is a root. To show that this is the minimal polynomial over Q \mathbb{Q} , we'll use some field theory. First, if β = 3 / 5 7 \beta = \sqrt[7]{3/5} , then Q [ β ] \mathbb{Q}[\beta] is an extension field of degree 7 over Q \mathbb{Q} . But β \beta satisfies a quadratic equation over Q [ α ] \mathbb{Q}[\alpha] , via

α = β + 1 β β 2 α β + 1 = 0 \alpha = \beta + \frac 1 \beta \implies \beta^2 - \alpha\beta + 1 = 0 .

Hence

7 = [ Q [ β ] : Q ] = [ Q [ β ] : Q [ α ] ] × [ Q [ α ] : Q ] 7 = [\mathbb{Q}[\beta]:\mathbb{Q}] = [\mathbb{Q}[\beta] : \mathbb{Q}[\alpha]] \times [\mathbb{Q}[\alpha] : \mathbb{Q}] ,

where [ Q [ β ] : Q [ α ] ] [\mathbb{Q}[\beta] : \mathbb{Q}[\alpha]] is 1 or 2. This gives [ Q [ α ] : Q ] = 7 [\mathbb{Q}[\alpha] : \mathbb{Q}] = 7 as desired so the above degree-7 polynomial is indeed the minimal polynomial over Q \mathbb{Q} . Hence:

f ( y ) = 15 y ( y 6 7 y 4 + 14 y 2 7 ) + 34 f(y) = -15 y(y^6 - 7y^4 + 14y^2 - 7)+34

which gives f(1) = 19.

The question of uniqueness is indeed very natural here, though it was not really intended as part of the problem (since it requires considerably more advanced knowledge). We were pleased to see that several solutions actually contained a proof of uniqueness, all based on the theory of field extensions.

Calvin Lin Staff - 7 years ago

Because α α is a root of the 7 t h 7th degree polynomial f ( x ) , f(x),

x x = = 3 5 7 \sqrt[7]{\frac {3}{5}} + + 5 3 7 \sqrt[7]{\frac {5}{3}}

From this equation we can get,

x 2 x^2 = = ( 3 5 ) 2 7 \sqrt[7]{(\frac {3}{5})^2} + + 2 2 + + ( 5 3 ) 2 7 \sqrt[7]{(\frac {5}{3})^2}

x 2 x^2 - 2 2 = = ( 3 5 ) 2 7 \sqrt[7]{(\frac {3}{5})^2} + + ( 5 3 ) 2 7 \sqrt[7]{(\frac {5}{3})^2}

( x 2 (x^2 - 2 ) 2 2)^2 = = ( 3 5 ) 4 7 \sqrt[7]{(\frac {3}{5})^4} + + 2 2 + + ( 5 3 ) 4 7 \sqrt[7]{(\frac {5}{3})^4}

( x 2 (x^2 - 2 ) 2 2)^2 - 2 2 = = ( 3 5 ) 4 7 \sqrt[7]{(\frac {3}{5})^4} + + ( 5 3 ) 4 7 \sqrt[7]{(\frac {5}{3})^4} \dots ( 1 ) (1)

Also,

x 3 x^3 = = ( 3 5 ) 3 7 \sqrt[7]{(\frac {3}{5})^3} + + 3 3 5 7 3\sqrt[7]{\frac {3}{5}} + + 3 5 3 7 3\sqrt[7]{\frac {5}{3}} + + ( 5 3 ) 3 7 \sqrt[7]{(\frac {5}{3})^3}

x 3 x^3 - 3 x 3x = = ( 3 5 ) 3 7 \sqrt[7]{(\frac {3}{5})^3} + + ( 5 3 ) 3 7 \sqrt[7]{(\frac {5}{3})^3} \dots ( 2 ) (2)

From ( 1 ) (1) × \times ( 2 ) (2) we can get,

( ( x 2 2 ) 2 2 ) ((x^2 - 2)^2 - 2) ( x 3 3 x ) (x^3 - 3x) = = ( ( 3 5 ) 4 7 (\sqrt[7]{(\frac {3}{5})^4} + + ( 5 3 ) 4 7 ) \sqrt[7]{(\frac {5}{3})^4}) ( ( 3 5 ) 3 7 (\sqrt[7]{(\frac {3}{5})^3} + + ( 5 3 ) 3 7 ) \sqrt[7]{(\frac {5}{3})^3})

( ( x 2 2 ) 2 2 ) ((x^2 - 2)^2 - 2) ( x 3 3 x ) (x^3 - 3x) = = 3 5 \frac {3}{5} + + 3 5 7 \sqrt[7]{\frac {3}{5}} + + 5 3 7 \sqrt[7]{\frac {5}{3}} + + 5 3 \frac {5}{3}

( ( x 2 2 ) 2 2 ) ((x^2 - 2)^2 - 2) ( x 3 3 x ) (x^3 - 3x) = = x x + + 34 15 \frac {34}{15}

15 -15 ( ( x 2 2 ) 2 2 ) ((x^2 - 2)^2 - 2) ( x 3 3 x ) (x^3 - 3x) + + 15 x 15x + + 34 34 = = 0 0

Hence, f ( x ) f(x) = = 15 -15 ( ( x 2 2 ) 2 2 ) ((x^2 - 2)^2 - 2) ( x 3 3 x ) (x^3 - 3x) + + 15 x 15x + + 34 34

Substitute x x = = 1 , 1, we get f ( 1 ) f(1) = = 19 19

Binomial formula would have been slightly easier, but this works too.

Calvin Lin Staff - 7 years ago
Leonardo Chandra
May 20, 2014

Suppose that x= ( p ) 1 / 7 (p)^{1/7} + ( 1 / p ) 1 / 7 (1/p)^{1/7} , where p= 3/5 So:

x 2 x^2 -2 = ( p ) 2 / 7 (p)^ {2/7} + ( 1 / p ) 2 / 7 (1/p)^{2/7} ...(1)

x 3 x^3 - 3 x 3x = ( p ) 3 / 7 (p)^{3/7} + ( 1 / p ) 3 / 7 (1/p)^{3/7} ...(2)

x 4 x^4 - 4 x 4x +2 = ( p ) 4 / 7 (p)^{4/7} + ( 1 / p ) 4 / 7 (1/p)^{4/7} ....(3)

x 5 x^5 - 5 x 3 5x^{3} + 5 x 5x = ( p ) 5 / 7 (p)^{5/7} + ( 1 / p ) 5 / 7 (1/p)^{5/7} ....(4)

Then take a power of 7 in the both sides to obtain:

x 7 x^7 = ( ( p ) 1 / 7 ((p)^{1/7} + ( 1 / p ) 1 / 7 (1/p)^{1/7} ) 7 ^7

Expand the right side to get:

x 7 x^7 = ( 7 ( 1 / p ) 1 / 7 (7(1/p)^{1/7} p 6 / 7 p^{6/7} + 21 ( 1 / p ) 2 / 7 21(1/p)^{2/7} p 5 / 7 p^{5/7} + 35 ( 1 / p ) 3 / 7 35*(1/p)^{3/7} p 4 / 7 p^{4/7} + 35 ( 1 / p ) 4 / 7 35*(1/p)^{4/7} p 3 / 7 p^{3/7} + 21 ( 1 / p ) 5 / 7 21*(1/p)^{5/7} p 2 / 7 p^{2/7} +p+ 7 ( 1 / p ) 6 / 7 7*(1/p)^{6/7} p 1 / 7 p^{1/7} + 1 / p 1/p

x 7 x^7 = p+(1/p)+ 7 p 5 / 7 7p^{5/7} + ( 7 / p ) 5 / 7 (7/p)^{5/7} + 21 p 3 / 7 21p^{3/7} + ( 21 / p ) 3 / 7 (21/p)^{3/7} + ( 35 p ) 1 / 7 (35p)^{1/7} + ( 35 / p ) 1 / 7 (35/p)^{1/7}

Because p=3/5, so p+1/p=34/15, then multiply both sides with 15 to get:

15 x 7 15x^7 =34+15( 7 ( p 5 / 7 7(p^{5/7} + ( 1 / p ) 5 / 7 ) (1/p)^{5/7}) )+ 15 21 15*21 ( ( p ) 3 / 7 (p)^{3/7} + ( 1 / p ) 3 / 7 (1/p)^{3/7} )+ 15 35 15*35 ( p 1 / 7 p^{1/7} + ( 1 / p ) 1 / 7 (1/p)^{1/7} )

Substituting all the equations (1),(2),(4) to obtain:

15 x 7 15x^7 =34+105( x 5 x^5 - 5 x 3 5x^3 + 5 x 5x )+ 15 21 15*21 ( x 3 x^3 -3x)+ 15 35 x 15*35x

f(x)= 15 x 7 -15x^7 + 105 ( x 5 5 x 3 + 5 x ) 105(x^5-5x^3+5x) + 15 21 ( x 3 3 x ) 15*21(x^3-3x) + 15 35 x 15*35x +34

Thus, substituting x=1 to get:

f(1)= -15+105+ 15 21 15*21 + 15 35 15*35 +34

f(1)= -15+34

f(1)= 19

Marek Bernat
May 20, 2014

We will proceed directly by finding f ( x ) f(x) . Since α \alpha is a root of this polynomial, it must be possible to express α 7 \alpha^7 as a sum of monomials α k \alpha^k of lower degree with rational coefficients. Let us write b = 3 / 5 7 b = \sqrt[7]{3/5} so that α = b + 1 / b \alpha = b + 1/b and compute

α 7 = b 7 + 7 b 5 + 21 b 3 + 35 b + 35 / b + 21 / b 3 + 7 / b 5 + 1 / b 7 . \alpha^7 = b^7 + 7 b^5 + 21 b^3 + 35 b + 35 / b + 21 / b^3 + 7 / b^5 + 1/b^7 .

Our strategy now will be to succesively subtract different powers of α \alpha so that only the rational term b 7 b^7 remains. So compute further

α 5 = b 5 + 5 b 3 + 10 b + 10 / b + 5 / b 3 + 1 / b 5 \alpha^5 = b^5 + 5 b^3 + 10 b + 10 / b + 5 / b^3 + 1 / b^5

and

α 3 = b 3 + 3 b + 3 / b + 1 / b 3 . \alpha^3 = b^3 + 3 b + 3 / b + 1 / b^3 .

It is then not hard to see that

α 7 7 α 5 + 14 α 3 + 7 α = b 7 + 1 / b 7 = 3 / 5 + 5 / 3. \alpha^7 - 7 \alpha^5 + 14 \alpha^3 + 7 \alpha = b^7 + 1/b^7 = 3/5 + 5/3 .

But this means that we have found the polynomial with integer coefficients that α \alpha is a root of, namely

f ( x ) = 15 ( x 7 7 x 5 + 14 x 3 + 7 x 34 / 15 ) . f(x) = -15( x^7 - 7x^5 + 14 x^3 + 7x -34/15).

Now we simply plug in x = 1 x=1 to get f ( 1 ) = 15 + 34 = 19 f(1) = -15 + 34 = 19 .

David Vaccaro
May 20, 2014

The Binomial Expansion gives:

  • ( x + 1 x ) 7 = x 7 + 7 ( x 5 + 1 x 5 ) + 21 ( x 3 + 1 x 3 ) + 35 ( x + 1 x ) (x+\frac {1}{x})^{7}=x^{7}+7(x^{5}+\frac {1}{x^{5}})+21(x^{3}+\frac {1}{x^{3}})+35(x+\frac {1}{x})
  • ( x + 1 x ) 5 = ( x 5 + 1 x 5 ) + 5 ( x 3 + 1 x 3 ) + 10 ( x + 1 x ) (x+\frac {1}{x})^{5}=(x^{5}+\frac {1}{x^{5}})+5(x^{3}+\frac {1}{x^{3}})+10(x+\frac {1}{x})
  • ( x + 1 x ) 3 = ( x 3 + 1 x 3 ) + 3 ( x + 1 x ) (x+\frac {1}{x})^{3}=(x^{3}+\frac {1}{x^{3}})+3(x+\frac {1}{x})

Combining these give:

  • ( x + 1 x ) 7 = x 7 + 1 x 7 + 7 ( x + 1 x ) 5 14 ( x + 1 x ) 3 + 7 ( x + 1 x ) (x+\frac {1}{x})^{7}=x^{7}+\frac {1}{x^{7}}+7(x+\frac {1}{x})^{5}-14(x+\frac {1}{x})^{3}+7(x+\frac {1}{x})

Putting x = 5 3 7 x=\sqrt [7]{\frac {5}{3}} gives:

  • α 7 = 34 15 + 7 α 5 14 α 3 + 7 α \alpha^{7}=\frac {34}{15}+7\alpha^{5}-14\alpha^{3}+7\alpha

Hence Viet's polynomial is:

  • f ( x ) = 34 + 105 x 5 210 x 3 + 105 x 15 x 7 f(x)=34+105x^{5}-210x^{3}+105x-15x^{7}

So f ( 1 ) = 19 f(1)=19

There is a question of uniqueness, but it is possible to show that f is irreducible.

possibly feature

Calvin Lin Staff - 7 years ago
Michal Forišek
May 20, 2014

Let p = 3 / 5 7 p=\sqrt[7]{3/5} . We then have 5 / 3 7 = 1 / p \sqrt[7]{5/3} = 1/p and we can write α = p + 1 / p \alpha = p + 1/p . We now want to find the minimal polynomial for α \alpha . We can make an educated guess that the degree of this polynomial will be 7.

Taking the seventh power of the above equation gives us the following:

α 7 = p 7 + 7 p 5 + 21 p 3 + 35 p + 35 ( 1 p ) + 21 ( 1 p ) 3 + 7 ( 1 p ) 5 + ( 1 p ) 7 \alpha^7 = p^7 + 7p^5 + 21p^3 + 35p + 35\left(\frac{1}{p}\right) + 21\left(\frac{1}{p}\right)^3 + 7\left(\frac{1}{p}\right)^5 + \left(\frac{1}{p}\right)^7

Parts of this look nice: p 7 = 3 / 5 p^7 = 3/5 , ( 1 p ) 7 = ( 5 / 3 ) \left(\frac{1}{p}\right)^7=(5/3) , and 35 p + 35 ( 1 p ) = 35 α 35p + 35\left(\frac{1}{p}\right) = 35\alpha . We still have to deal with the fifth and the third powers of p p and 1 / p 1/p .

In order to do that, let's take the fifth power of the original equation:

α 5 = p 5 + 5 p 3 + 10 p + 10 ( 1 p ) + 5 ( 1 p ) 3 + ( 1 p ) 5 \alpha^5 = p^5 + 5p^3 + 10p + 10\left(\frac{1}{p}\right) + 5\left(\frac{1}{p}\right)^3 + \left(\frac{1}{p}\right)^5

Scaling it and subtracting from the equation for the seventh power, we get:

α 7 7 α 5 = p 7 14 p 3 35 p 35 ( 1 p ) 14 ( 1 p ) 3 + ( 1 p ) 7 \alpha^7 - 7\alpha^5 = p^7 -14 p^3 - 35p - 35\left(\frac{1}{p}\right) - 14\left(\frac{1}{p}\right)^3 + \left(\frac{1}{p}\right)^7

And now we do the same with the equation for α 3 \alpha^3 to obtain the following:

α 7 7 α 5 + 14 α 3 = p 7 + 7 p + 7 ( 1 p ) + ( 1 p ) 7 \alpha^7 - 7\alpha^5 + 14\alpha^3 = p^7 + 7p + 7\left(\frac{1}{p}\right) + \left(\frac{1}{p}\right)^7

And that can now be rewritten as

α 7 7 α 5 + 14 α 3 = ( 3 / 5 ) + 7 α + ( 5 / 3 ) \alpha^7 - 7\alpha^5 + 14\alpha^3 = (3/5) + 7\alpha + (5/3)

From this expression and the condition that the leading coefficient of the polynomial should be -15 we see that α \alpha is the root of the following polynomial:

p ( x ) = 15 x 7 + 105 x 5 210 x 3 + 105 x + 34 p(x) = -15x^7 + 105x^5 - 210x^3 + 105x + 34

Thus, p ( 1 ) = 15 + 105 210 + 105 + 34 = 19 p(1) = -15+105-210+105+34 = 19 .

Alex Yu
May 20, 2014

For convenience, let z = x + 1 x z=x+\dfrac{1}{x} . Note that we have x 3 + 1 x 3 = ( x + 1 x ) 3 3 x 3 x = z 3 3 z x^3+\dfrac{1}{x^3} = \left(x+\dfrac{1}{x}\right)^3 - 3x-\dfrac{3}{x} = z^3-3z , and that x 5 + 1 x 5 = ( x + 1 x ) 5 5 x 3 10 x 10 x 5 x 3 x^5 + \dfrac{1}{x^5} = \left(x+\dfrac{1}{x}\right)^5 -5x^3-10x-\dfrac{10}{x} - \dfrac{5}{x^3} = z 5 5 ( z 3 3 z ) 10 z = z 5 5 z 3 + 5 z =z^5 - 5(z^3-3z) - 10z = z^5-5z^3+5z , obtained by expanding the expressions in the parentheses via Binomial Theorem.

Then we have that x 7 + 1 x 7 = ( x + 1 x ) 7 7 x 5 21 x 3 35 x 35 x 21 x 3 7 x 5 x^7+\dfrac{1}{x^7} = \left(x+\dfrac{1}{x}\right)^7 -7x^5-21x^3-35x-\dfrac{35}{x}-\dfrac{21}{x^3} - \dfrac{7}{x^5} = z 7 7 ( z 5 5 z 3 + 5 z ) 21 ( z 3 3 z ) 35 z = z 7 7 z 5 + 14 z 3 7 z =z^7 - 7(z^5-5z^3+5z) - 21(z^3-3z) - 35z = z^7-7z^5+14z^3-7z (*).

If we assign x = 3 5 7 , 1 x = 5 3 7 x=\sqrt[7]{\dfrac{3}{5}}, \dfrac{1}{x} = \sqrt[7]{\dfrac{5}{3}} , then clearly x + 1 x = α x+\dfrac{1}{x} = \alpha , and also x 7 + 1 x 7 = 3 5 + 5 3 = 34 15 x^7+\dfrac{1}{x^7} = \dfrac{3}{5}+\dfrac{5}{3} = \dfrac{34}{15} . Additionally, according to the equation (*), since z = α z=\alpha we have that x 7 + 1 x 7 = 34 15 = α 7 7 α 5 + 14 α 3 7 α x^7+\dfrac{1}{x^7} = \dfrac{34}{15} = \alpha^7-7\alpha^5+14\alpha^3-7\alpha . Moving everything over to one side and multiplying by 15 -15 yields the equation 15 α 7 + 105 α 5 210 α 3 + 105 α + 34 = 0 -15\alpha^7 + 105\alpha^5 - 210\alpha^3 + 105\alpha+34=0 , and so α \alpha is a root of this 7th degree polynomial, which satisfies the conditions of the problem, as it has integer coefficients and a leading coefficient of 15 -15 . Thus, we have found f ( x ) f(x) . Substituting x = 1 x=1 yields f ( 1 ) = 15 + 105 210 + 105 + 34 = 19 f(1) = -15+105-210+105+34 = \boxed{19} .

Bob Bobson
May 20, 2014

First we will find a polynomial with integer coefficients of degree 7 7 , with leading coefficient 15 -15 and with α = 3 5 7 + 5 3 7 \alpha = \sqrt[7]{\frac{3}{5}}+\sqrt[7]{\frac{5}{3}} as a root. To fully solve the problem, it must be shown that this polynomial is unique, or at least that its value at 1 1 is unique. This will be discussed briefly at the end.

Let y = 5 3 7 y = \sqrt[7]{\frac{5}{3}} so that α = y + 1 / y \alpha = y + 1/y . Since we are after a polynomial of degree 7 7 , we will look at the value α 7 \alpha^7 . This is

( y + 1 / y ) 7 = ( y 7 + y 7 ) + 7 ( y 5 + y 5 ) + 21 ( y 3 + y 3 ) + 35 ( y + y 1 ) . (y+1/y)^7 = (y^7 + y^{-7}) + 7(y^5 + y^{-5}) + 21(y^3 + y^{-3}) + 35(y + y^{-1}).

On the right hand side, there are two things we know already. The value y + 1 / y y + 1/y is simply α \alpha and y 7 + y 7 y^7+y^{-7} is just 3 / 5 + 5 / 3 = 34 / 15 3/5+5/3 = 34/15 . Let's examine the remaining terms y 3 + y 3 y^3+y^{-3} and y 5 + y 5 y^5+y^{-5} . We see that

( y + 1 / y ) 3 = ( y 3 + y 3 ) + 3 ( y + y 1 ) (y+1/y)^3 = (y^3 + y^{-3}) + 3(y+y^{-1})

so

y 3 + y 3 = α 3 3 α . y^3+y^{-3} = \alpha^3 - 3\alpha.

Similarly,

( y + 1 / y ) 5 = ( y 5 + y 5 ) + 5 ( y 3 + y 3 ) + 10 ( y + y 1 ) . (y+1/y)^5 = (y^5+y^{-5}) + 5(y^3+y^{-3}) + 10(y+y^{-1}).

So

y 5 + y 5 = α 5 5 ( y 3 + y 3 ) + 10 α y^5+y^{-5} =\alpha^5 - 5(y^3+y^{-3}) + 10\alpha = α 5 5 ( α 3 3 α ) + 10 α = \alpha^5 - 5(\alpha^3-3\alpha) + 10\alpha = α 5 5 α % 3 5 α . = \alpha^5- 5\alpha\%3 - 5\alpha.

Plugging in these values for y 3 + y 3 y^3+y^{-3} and y 5 + y 5 y^5+y^{-5} into our earlier equation for α 7 \alpha^7 we find that

α 7 = 7 α 5 14 α 3 + 7 α + 34 / 15 \alpha^7 = 7\alpha^5 -14 \alpha^3 + 7 \alpha +34/15

and so

f ( x ) = 15 x 7 + 7 x 5 14 x 3 + 7 x + 34 f(x) = -15x^7 + 7x^5 - 14x^3 + 7x + 34

has α \alpha as a root, and all of the requirements as phrased in the problem. Furthermore we have

f ( 1 ) = 19. \boxed{f(1) = 19.}

Now returning to our point of the uniqueness of the polynomial f ( x ) f(x) with the prescribed properties. To do this we will assume some knowledge of the theory of field extensions. The element α \alpha lies in the field α Q ( 3 7 , 5 7 ) \alpha \in \mathbb Q(\sqrt[7]{3},\sqrt[7]{5}) , the field of rationals Q \mathbb Q extended to contain both the 7 7 th root of 3 3 and 5 5 . This field extension has degree 49 = 7 2 49 = 7^2 over Q \mathbb Q and any element of this field satisfies some irreducible polynomial with rational coefficients of some degree dividing the degree of the extension, 49 49 . We have shown that α \alpha satisfies a polynomial of degree 7 7 so either this is irreducible, or α \alpha satisfies a polynomial of degree 1 1 over Q \mathbb Q , i.e. α Q \alpha \in \mathbb Q . If α = y + 1 / y Q \alpha = y + 1/y \in \mathbb Q then y y satisfies the quadratic polynomial with rational coefficients y 2 α y + 1 = 0 y^2 - \alpha y + 1 = 0 , but by the same reasoning, y y is the root of either an irreducible polynomial of degree 7 7 or 1 1 and it clearly y ∉ Q y \not \in \mathbb Q , so y y cannot satisfy a polynomial of degree 2 2 over Q \mathbb Q , and so we must have α ∉ Q \alpha \not \in \mathbb Q .

The question of uniqueness of the polynomial f f is indeed very natural here, however it is much harder than the problem as it was intended.

Calvin Lin Staff - 7 years ago
Tubagus Dhafin
May 20, 2014

first we move from leading coefficient let 5 3 7 = a \sqrt[7]{\frac {5}{3}}= a and 3 5 7 = b \sqrt[7]{\frac {3}{5}}=b so α = a + b \alpha=a+b and we get a b = 1 ab=1 let f ( x ) = 15 x 7 f(x)=-15x^7 and we know that 0 = f ( α ) = 15 α 7 = 15 ( a + b ) 7 0=f(\alpha)=-15\alpha^7=-15(a+b)^7 0 = 15 ( a 7 + 7 a b ( a 5 + b 5 ) + 21 ( a b ) 2 ( a 3 + b 3 ) + 35 ( a b ) 3 ( a + b ) + b 7 0=-15(a^7+7ab(a^5+b^5)+21(ab)^2(a^3+b^3)+35(ab)^3(a+b)+b^7 so we get 0 = 15 ( a 7 + 7 ( a 5 + b 5 ) + 21 ( a 3 + b 3 ) + 35 ( a + b ) + b 7 ) 0=-15(a^7+7(a^5+b^5)+21(a^3+b^3)+35(a+b)+b^7) 0 = 34 105 ( a 5 + b 5 ) 315 ( a 3 + b 3 ) 525 ( a + b ) 0=-34-105(a^5+b^5)-315(a^3+b^3)-525(a+b) we must erase 105 ( a 5 + b 5 ) -105(a^5+b^5) in left side so we must add 105 x 5 105x^5 in f ( x ) f(x) so we get f ( x ) = 15 x 7 + 105 x 5 f(x)=-15x^7+105x^5 if we use binomial newton we can get 0 = 34 + 210 ( a 3 + b 3 ) + 525 ( a + b ) 0=-34+210(a^3+b^3)+525(a+b) we must erase 210 ( a 3 + b 3 ) 210(a^3+b^3) in left side so we must add 210 x 3 ) -210x^3) in f ( x ) f(x) so we get f ( x ) = 15 x 7 + 105 x 5 210 x 3 f(x)=-15x^7+105x^5-210x^3
so we can get 0 = 34 105 ( a + b ) 0=-34-105(a+b) equation same if we add 34 + 105 x 34+105x in f ( x ) f(x) so we get f ( x ) = 15 x 7 + 105 x 5 210 x 3 + 105 x + 34 f(x)=-15x^7+105x^5-210x^3+105x+34 f ( 1 ) = 15 ( 1 ) 7 + 105 ( 1 ) 5 210 ( 1 ) 3 + 105 ( 1 ) + 34 f(1)=-15(1)^7+105(1)^5-210(1)^3+105(1)+34 f ( 1 ) = 15 + 105 210 + 105 + 34 = 19 f(1)=-15+105-210+105+34=19

Eric Edwards
May 20, 2014

For this problem, we want to find the sum of the coefficients of f(x) . First, consider what happens with the 7th order term when we plug in the root. By the binomial theorem, we have 15 ( 3 5 7 + 5 3 7 ) 7 = ( 9 + 105 ( 3 5 ) 5 / 7 + + 25 ) -15(\sqrt[7]{\frac{3}{5}} + \sqrt[7]{\frac{5}{3}})^7 = -(9+105(\frac{3}{5})^{5/7} + \cdots + 25) Since we have only integer coefficients, the only term in f(x) that can cancel the -(9+25) = -34 is the constant term. This makes the sum of known coefficients so far -15+34=19. I believe we should be able to argue from symmetry at this point that the middle coefficients must cancel. However, the rigorous argument eludes me, so we shall proceed to find the rest of the polynomial with some algebraic computation. This is more work, but it gives us infinitely more information than the problem asked for, which is pretty neat. The next highest term in the polynomial must be 105 x 5 105x^5 in order to cancel ( 3 5 ) 5 / 7 (\frac{3}{5})^{5/7} that appeared above. Expanding 105 ( 3 5 7 + 5 3 7 ) 5 105(\sqrt[7]{\frac{3}{5}} + \sqrt[7]{\frac{5}{3}})^5 and seeking to cancel terms, we get that the next term must be -210x^3. This is a bit cumbersome to write out, so I will stick to this sketch. One more application of binomial theorem and collecting terms finishes the problem to give f ( x ) = 15 x 7 + 105 x 5 210 x 3 + 105 x + 34. f(x) = -15x^7 + 105x^5 - 210x^3 + 105x +34. Thus, f ( 1 ) = 19. f(1) = 19. I happened to note that f ( 2 ) = 4 f(2) =4 , which is quite small. The root that we began with must be close to 2.

Shashank Goel
May 20, 2014

Let x=\alpha^{1/7}+\frac{1}{\alpha^{1/7}} where \alpha = \frac{3}{5}

The following identities can be established:

\alpha^{2/7}+\frac{1}{\alpha^{2/7}} = x^{2}-2 \alpha^{3/7}+\frac{1}{\alpha^{3/7}} = x^{3}-3x \alpha^{4/7}+\frac{1}{\alpha^{4/7}} = x^{4}-4x+2 \alpha^{5/7}+\frac{1}{\alpha^{5/7}} = x^{5}-5x^{3}+5x

Coupled with the binomial expansion for x^{7} = (\alpha^{1/7}+\frac{1}{\alpha^{1/7}})^{7} we get:

f(x) = -15(x^{7}-7x^{5}+14x^{3}-7x)+34 So that f(1)=19

Many details are missing

Calvin Lin Staff - 7 years ago

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