Why Isn't It Reducible?

Algebra Level 4

Let A = 1 2 × 3 4 × 5 6 × × 2013 2014 A= \frac{1}{2} \times \frac{3}{4} \times \frac{5}{6} \times\cdots\times \frac{2013}{2014} B = 2 3 × 4 5 × 6 7 × × 2012 2013 B= \frac{2}{3} \times \frac{4}{5} \times \frac{6}{7} \times\cdots \times \frac{2012}{2013} C = 1 2014 C= \frac{1}{ \sqrt{2014} }

Which of the following statements is true?
1. A < B < C 1. A < B < C
2. A < C < B 2. A < C < B
3. B < A < C 3. B < A < C
4. B < C < A 4. B < C < A
5. C < A < B 5. C < A < B
6. C < B < A 6. C < B < A
7. 7. Two of them are equal
8. 8. All of them are equal


The answer is 2.

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32 solutions

Piyushkumar Palan
Dec 29, 2013

Let fractions in A be denoted as a 1 , a 2 , a 3 , . . . , a 1007 a_1, a_2, a_3, ... , a_{1007}

Let fractions in B be denoted as b 1 , b 2 , b 3 , . . . , b 1006 b_1, b_2, b_3, ... , b_{1006}

But a 1 < b 1 , a 2 < b 2 , a 3 < b 3 . . . . a 1006 < b 1006 , a 1007 < 1 a_1 < b_1, a_2 < b_2, a_3 < b_3 .... a_{1006} < b_{1006}, a_{1007} < 1

Multiplying all these, A < B A < B

Observe that A × B = 1 2014 = C 2 A \times B = \frac{1}{2014} = C^2

So A , C , B A, C, B are positive numbers forming increasing G.P. (Geometric Progression)

Hence option 2 : A < C < B \boxed {2: A < C < B}

Well done sir ! This is an ultimate approach !

Priyansh Saxena - 7 years, 5 months ago

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thanks Priyansh.

Piyushkumar Palan - 7 years, 5 months ago

Same question in A.I Prelipiko.

Aman Anand - 5 years, 4 months ago

This is so simple, I don't realize it

Muh. Amin Widyatama - 7 years, 5 months ago

Yeah I did the same proof.

Takeda Shigenori - 7 years, 5 months ago

wow, great idea :)

Po Bo - 7 years, 5 months ago

did just the same.....:-)

arkajyoti maity - 7 years, 5 months ago

I did it for a really small case, namely 1/2 * 3/4, vs 2/3, vs 1/sqrt(4)=1/2. then I just put that and assumed it was right... but yeah your solution is actually rigorous =)

faraz masroor - 7 years, 3 months ago

Wonderful Just amazing Sir you are a Genius Genius

U Z - 6 years, 7 months ago

Beautiful, simple, straightforward approach . Up Voted.

Niranjan Khanderia - 6 years ago

Very easy explanation. Thanks for that, helps a lot.

Kenneth Gravamen - 5 years, 9 months ago

A good approach to the problem...

Amlan Mishra - 7 years, 5 months ago

excellent sir? r u a student or teacher

Chandra Shekhar Agrawal - 7 years, 5 months ago

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He's just everything... We're so proud to be his students.... @Chandra Shekhar Agrawal ... amazing teacher @Piyushkumar Palan

Aditya Raut - 6 years, 9 months ago

Correctly said @Aditya Raut .....proud to be his students.....

Pranit Bavishi - 6 years, 9 months ago

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The most upvoted solution I have seen, it has 96 upvotes including mine, just need 4 more to get a solid 100 100 .

Aditya Raut - 6 years, 9 months ago

superb!!! I was stuck after finding out the relation. it didn't clicked me what I was looking was a GM . Thanks!

Arpit Kothari - 7 years, 4 months ago

just did the same here

Souvik Pratiher - 7 years, 4 months ago

Look at the form of A and B.Does it tell us that last term that is 2014 has any another property that is not owned by 4............Isn't it?So why not we try to obtain answer by taking last term as 4.............Nice naa.

Aamir Faisal Ansari - 7 years, 4 months ago

Exactly the same proof! If I would have more experience in GP, this could be solved much faster!

Rishabh Raj - 7 years, 3 months ago

Yeah, did the same. But the problem startled me for once.

Rajarshi Chatterjee - 5 years, 12 months ago

I got both facts but couldn't summarise to get that it might be g.p.. Really u did excellent observation

himanshu mishra - 5 years, 11 months ago

Excellent observation

himanshu mishra - 5 years, 11 months ago

upvoted . A very good solution

Rama Devi - 5 years, 11 months ago

Did just same &i got☺

Sourav Kumar Surya - 5 years, 11 months ago

Did the same way

Samarth Agarwal - 5 years, 10 months ago

Did the same!

Arpon Paul - 5 years, 7 months ago

Same method and nice problem :)

Siddhant Chaudhari - 5 years, 3 months ago

Elegant..nice .. Easy ty sir

Pawan pal - 5 years, 1 month ago

Beautiful solution sir +1! Nice question also.!

Rishabh Tiwari - 5 years ago

Did the same !(+1)

Sumanth R Hegde - 4 years, 5 months ago

Did the same! Nice! Easy peasy!

Kartik Sharma - 6 years ago
Pranav Arora
Dec 30, 2013

Multiply A A and B B to get:

A B = 1 2014 ( ) \displaystyle AB=\frac{1}{2014}\,\,\, (*) .

Now divide A A and B B to get:

A B = 3 4 × 15 16 × 35 36 201 3 2 2012 × 2014 \displaystyle \frac{A}{B}=\frac{3}{4}\times \frac{15}{16} \times \frac{35}{36} \cdots \frac{2013^2}{2012\times 2014}

It is easy to see that the right hand side is less than 1, hence A < B ( ) A<B\,\,\, (**) .

Lets get back to ( ) (*) , it is equal to C 2 C^2 . This shows that A , C A,C and B B are in geometric progression so the possible orders are: A < C < B A<C<B and B < C < A B<C<A but from ( ) (**) , the only possible order is A<C<B \fbox{A<C<B} .

A cool way to check wether A A or B B is bigger. Just one thing: A B = 3 4 × 15 16 × 35 36 × . . . × 2011 × 2013 201 2 2 × 2013 2014 \frac{A}{B} = \frac{3}{4} \times \frac{15}{16} \times \frac{35}{36} \times ... \times \frac{2011 \times 2013 }{2012^2} \times \frac{2013}{2014}

Takeda Shigenori - 7 years, 5 months ago

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Nice one, didn't think about that. XD

Samuraiwarm Tsunayoshi - 7 years, 5 months ago

Thanks! :)

Pranav Arora - 7 years, 5 months ago

All corresponding terms of A are less than those of B. B has one less term, & all terms are fractions. Therefore A<B. Isn't this better reasoning sir ?

Priyansh Saxena - 7 years, 5 months ago

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Yeah there was another person who did this way

Takeda Shigenori - 7 years, 5 months ago

I really think THERE MUST BE A MINIMUM of more than 3 options in such problems WHERE we get 3 attempts...

Shreya R - 7 years, 2 months ago

Okay, I don't get how A , B , C A, B, C are in a geometric progression. Why and how?

Bloons Qoth - 4 years, 4 months ago

Wrong.Check your proof.

Dave Day - 5 years, 10 months ago

Wrong proof. Lucky guy to get it right.

Chandranshu C - 4 years, 6 months ago

Wrong proof

Balaji Subramoniam - 2 years, 7 months ago

Simple and Effective. The best of every answers. I thought in a variation of this way.

Cleres Cupertino - 5 years, 11 months ago

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You're wrong when you say that A/C=C/B=1/sqrt(2014) Even worse, you don't know how to use Latex...

Louis Noizet - 4 years, 8 months ago
Vishnu C
Jun 11, 2015

Looks like I'm the only idiot who used Stirling's approximation to solve this one (sigh).

A= 2 n ! ! ( 2 n 1 ) ! ! ) = 1 π n \frac{2n!!}{(2n-1)!!)}=\frac 1 {\sqrt{\pi n}} (simplified using Stirling's approximation) and B= 1 2 n × A \frac{1}{2n\times A} , where n = 2014 2 = 1007. \frac {2014} 2=1007.

Substitute n=1007 and you get:

A = 0.017779...

B = 0.27927...

C = 0.2228...

Clearly, B>C>A.

I guess as soon as I saw double factorials and a square root in the question, I jumped to Stirling's approximation. Doh!

Don't feel sad. Instead you are one of the geniuses since you have found a totally brand new method to solve. Furthermore there are such who weren't able to even solve it, keep up and always post novel solution no matter how complex they are because what may be complex to you might be beautiful to somebody else. Nice solution upvoted!

Puneet Pinku - 5 years ago
Adit Mohan
Dec 31, 2013

1 2 \frac{1}{2} < 2 3 \frac{2}{3} , 3 4 \frac{3}{4} < 4 5 \frac{4}{5} ......
A has 1007 such terms while B has 1006 such terms.
thus B>A.
A B \sqrt{AB} =C.
by AM GM inequality A+B>2C.
Thus B>C.
if A>C then then AB= C 2 C^{2} is not possible.
thus A<C<B






there is a problem in ur answer that is "if A>C then then AB=C^2 is not possible. thus A<C<B" it is possible to have A>C

Satya Teja Chikatla - 7 years, 4 months ago

Exactly As Satya said there is a flaw in your argument to deduce A < C. There can be cases where A>C and still satisfy A B = C \sqrt{AB}= C

Ajit Deshpande - 6 years ago

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can you elucidate such a case? keep in mind B>A and A,B and C are positive.

Adit Mohan - 6 years ago

So, all of us have solved this amazing problem with our precious Number Theory knowledge.

But a great alternative came across my neurons. Its Programming , which would take around 5 milli seconds to calculate these big calculations!

So, here's my different C programmed Solution .

Source Code: _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

# i n c l u d e < s t d i o . h > \#include<stdio.h>

# i n c l u d e < m a t h . h > \#include<math.h>

int main()

{

double n=2,A=1;

printf("I am not a brilliant Mathematician.\nBut I have my programming knowledge and my great computer!\nSo it makes everything easy!");

while(n<2015){

A=A*((n-1)/n);

n=n+2;

}

printf("\n\nA=%.100lf",A);

double N=3,B=1;

while(N<2014){

B=B*((n-1)/n);

N=N+2;

}

printf("\n\nB=%.100lf",B);

printf("\n\nC=%.100lf\n\nSo, obviously\n1. B ia greater than C,\n2. C is greater than A.\n\n To express mathematically, A<C<B!!!",(1/sqrt(2014)));

return 0;

}


*Output: *

There's always thousands of ways to solve any mathematical Problem, right!!!

Right, but actually you've got the value of B wrong it is really: 0.0279308 0.0279308

Moaaz Al-Qady - 5 years, 10 months ago

0.027930847579652422 0.027930847579652422 to be a bit more precise. Or i = 1 1006 2 i 2 i + 1 . \prod_{i = 1}^{1006} \dfrac{2i}{2i+1}.

Sindri Saevarsson - 4 years, 7 months ago
Alexander Jiang
Jan 30, 2014

First note that: A × B = 1 2014 A \times B = \frac{1}{2014}

Since A and B are rational numbers, neither A nor B can equal C. Also, since A times B equals C times C, we know that C is between A and B.

We can write A and B as: A = ( 1 2 × 3 4 × 5 6 × . . . × 2011 2012 ) × 2013 2014 A = (\frac{1}{2} \times \frac{3}{4} \times \frac{5}{6} \times ... \times \frac{2011}{2012}) \times \frac{2013}{2014} B = ( 2 3 × 4 5 × 6 7 × . . . × 2012 2013 ) B = (\frac{2}{3} \times \frac{4}{5} \times \frac{6}{7} \times ... \times \frac{2012}{2013})

Note that for each fraction that is a factor of A, the corresponding fraction that is a factor of B is larger. Finally, the extra term that is a factor of A, (2013/2014), is less than 1. Therefore, A is less than B, so B > C > A .

Nikola Djuric
Jun 19, 2015

notist that A=2013!!/2014!! multiply it by 2014!!/2014!! A=2014!/(2014!!)²=2014!/(1007! 1007! 2^2014)=(2014C1007)/2^2014 Same B=2012!!/2013!! 2012!!/2012!!= 2^2012 1006! 1006!/(2013 2012!) B=2^2012/(2013 (2012C1006)) so to compare A r B ,r is relation < or > (2014C1007)/2^2014 r 2^2012/(2013 (2012C1006)) i.e. 2014C1007 * 2013C1006 2013 r 2^2014 2^2012 as we know 2^2014=sum(2014Ck,k goes from 0 to 2014) so 2^2014 is at least 50 times bigger than 2014C1007,also 2^2012 is at least 50 times bigger than 2012C1006,so because 50 50/2013>1 that means that r is relation <,so A<B Similiar 1/√2014 < B because √2014 *2^2012 > 2013 2012C1006 because 50*√2014>2013 so C<B, also C>A because 2^2014> √2014 *2014C1007 beause 50>√2014 so A<C<B is correct

First we try A × B A\times B we get 1 2 × 2 3 × . . . × 2012 2013 × 2013 2014 \frac{1}{2} \times \frac{2}{3} \times ... \times \frac{2012}{2013} \times \frac{2013}{2014} .

A × B = 1 2014 A\times B = \frac{1}{2014}

If A = B A = B , then A = B = 1 2014 = C A = B = \frac{1}{\sqrt{2014}} = C

But A B A \neq B , then A > C > B A > C > B or A < C < B A < C <B (2 choices left, yay!)

Consider A A and B B ;

There're 1007 terms in A A but there're only 1006 terms in B B . (Don't think that A > B A > B immediately.)

The problem of A A is... A A has 1 2 \frac{1}{2} , which reduces a lot. (compare 3 4 \frac{3}{4} of A A to 2 3 \frac{2}{3} of B B , and so on... that doesn't change that much.)

Therefore, B > C > A B > C > A (or A < C < B A < C < B )... 2 \boxed{2} ~~~

Note: A B A \neq B because the numerator and denominator of A A and B B are not the same.

Well your argument could be cleaned up a lot easier. Note that

1 2 < 2 3 , 3 4 < 4 5 \frac{1}{2} < \frac{2}{3}, \frac{3}{4} < \frac{4}{5} and so on, and then A A has another term less than 1 1 which reduces it even further, so we can definitely say that A < B A < B

Your whole A A has one more term argument is pretty irrelevant and makes it even more confusing than it has to be: If A A has one term, that actually should suggest that A < B A < B since each term is less than 1 1 , no?

Michael Tong - 7 years, 5 months ago

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Yeah, that's true. My brain thinks that 2013 2014 \frac{2013}{2014} is a big number. I'm going to kill my brain in 1 day. XP

Samuraiwarm Tsunayoshi - 7 years, 5 months ago

I have also solved this, but your approach is much better. I failed to think this way, but I appreciate this! You kids are really more intelligent than us, though we are more experienced!!

Bharat Karmarkar - 7 years, 5 months ago
R Kumar
Jun 23, 2016

Simple use mathematical induction for n=1 1 We get the answer in one step

Fouad SAadi
May 15, 2016

first , if a and b are positive and a<b then a b \frac{a}{b} < a + 1 b + 1 \frac{a+1}{b+1} use the property to show than 1 2 \frac{1}{2} < 2 3 \frac{2}{3} , 3 4 \frac{3}{4} < 4 5 \frac{4}{5} .... 2011 2013 \frac{2011}{2013} < 2012 2014 \frac{2012}{2014} then by multiplying and considering that 2013 2014 \frac{2013}{2014} < 1 we can find that A< B from AB=C we conclude that A<B<C.

Mmmmm Mmmmm
Mar 24, 2016

note A*B=C^2

so A,B,C are in GM

so try 2,4,8

Lu Chee Ket
Oct 1, 2015

0.0177769159448591 0.0279308475796525 0.0222828258910793

A < C < B

Uahbid Dey
Sep 8, 2015
  1. A x B = 1/2014 = C²
  2. so, A/C = C/B
  3. Hence either A<C<B or A>C>B
  4. Now, A = 0.5 x 0.75 x ......... 2007 numbers fraction and
  5. B = 0.66..7 x 0.80 x ...... 2006 numbers fraction.
  6. now, 0.5<0.6666...; 0.75<0.80 ...... up to 2006 numbers of terms.
  7. hence if we omit 2013/2014 i.e. the last fraction of A and say it is K, till then the product of fractions in K<B.
  8. also (2013/2014) <1, hence (2013/2014) x K is still less than B.
  9. Hence A<B
  10. so, A<C<B.
Tom Van Lier
Aug 14, 2015

I wrote a mathlab script :-)

format long;

clear all;

A = 1;

B = 1;

C = 1/sqrt(2014);

for i = 1 : 1006

A = A*(2*i-1)/(2*i);

B = B*(2*i)/(2*i+1);

end

A = A*2013/2014;

A

B

C

Wooil Jung
Jul 12, 2015

Multiplying A and B gives us 1/2014, which is twice that of C. Therefore, if A and B were to be equal, then A, B, and C would all be the same.

However, if A or B was to be bigger than the other, we now have a situation where A<C<B or B<C<A. At this point, the answer is now narrowed down to 2, 4 or 8.

When looking at A and B, one may realize that every nth term in B is greater than the nth term of A, such as 1/2 < 2/3 for the first term, 3/4 < 4/5 and so on. Therefore, we can conclude B>A.

Using this information, the final answer seems to be B>C>A, or number 2. Which is right, by the way.

Steven Zheng
Jul 15, 2014

A clever problem, indeed.

Fred Shuman
Feb 4, 2014

Right away, you can eliminate choice 8, because A and B are rational, while C is not.

Generalize it. Let n = number of terms in A. Then there are n-1 terms in B. And by looking at the cases, n=1, 2, 3, you can come to some quick conclusions (keep in mind that a vacuous product is =1). In the example shown, n=1007. Now if you "cycle" each of the numerators in A one place to the left, A becomes identical to 1/B, but with an extra factor of 1/2n = 1/2014 at the end. So:

2n·A·B = 2014·A·B = 1

C, however, is just 1/√(2n) = 1/√2014. Now you can also see that each term in A is < each term in B, with that extra 2013/2014 at the end of A. And since that extra term is < 1, it's clear that A < B (scratch 3, 4, 6, & 7).

But C² = 1/(2n) = 1/2014 = A·B. So C is the mean proportional of A & B, and that means:

A < C < B (choice #2)

Shiva Vedere
Jan 24, 2014

1st step multiply A and B which gives AB=1/2014 In the 2nd step Square C which gives C^2= 1/2014 So, C^2= AB, that implies C is geometric mean of A and B....And also we know from 1st step A<B and as c is G.M, it follows the order A < B <C

Pulkit Kogta
Jan 23, 2014

just try it with first 2 terms of each A,B,C and u will get the answe.r

Srikanth Kummara
Jan 22, 2014

simple check for A= (1/2)*(3/4) b=2/3 c=1/square root of 4

this sequence is analogous to given compare values A=0.735 b=0.666 c=0.5 A<c<b

First thing I observed is

A*B = C^2

or, C is the geometric mean of A & B, it should lie between A and B

(NOTE: A,C,B being equal doesn't make sense as A and B are rational, C is irrational)

We have to figure out whether A<B or B<A

Now if we compare each terms of A & B:

1/2 is less than 2/3 .... 3/4 is less than 4/5 .... ... and so on ... 2011/2012 is less than 2012/2013

so: (1/2) (3/4) ...(2011/2012) < (2/3) (4/5) ...(2012/2013)

Now, 'A' is the LHS of the above inequality multiplied to (2013/2014) ... as (2013/2014) is a fraction, it reduces 'A' further.

So, A<B

and as, 'C' is lying between A &B

A<C<B

if u solve A & B, we arrive at B^2 = A*C therefore, A , B and C are in G.P. so, A<C<B

Sry, i made a mistake while typing,its c^2 = a*b

Nandita Sudalagunta - 7 years, 4 months ago
Bharat Karmarkar
Jan 13, 2014

B > A is easy to derive by regular way of comparing fractions. By minute inspection of numerators and denominators, B > C and C > A can be derived. Hence the result.

A= product of (2n-1)/(2n) from 1 to 1006 * 2013/2014

B= product of (2n)/(2n+1) from 1 to 1006 * 1

comparing each term, we get A<B

A*B=1/2014

C is the geometric mean of A and B and must be in between

therefore A<C<B

Kevin Chang
Jan 2, 2014

Because every term in A A is less than a corresponding term in B B , we have that A < B A<B . Also, we have that A B = 1 2014 = C 2 AB=\frac{1}{2014}=C^2 , so C C is the geometric mean of A A and B B , so A < C < B A<C<B . Hence, the answer is 2 2 .

Jashwanth Guduru
Jan 1, 2014

Clearly, A<B because 1/2 < 2/3 , 3/4 < 4/5 , and so on. Also, C is the geometric mean of A and B. So, A<C<B

We easily can see that AB = C 2 C^{2}

Also, A < B. So, A, C, B form an increasing G.P. Hence A < C < B.

Leonardo DiCaprio
Dec 31, 2013

We observe that A/B is almost 1/2014 < 1 so A<B.

Again, AB = C^2 so this implies C<B.

The hard part is to prove that A<C. For this I took the ratio A/C and as I calculated 1/2 x 3/4 x 5/6 x ... x 2013 / sqrt(2014) progressively I observed the product is decreasing (as it should be) and ultimately it falls off by 1/100 which on being multiplied with a two digit integer will definitely be < 1

Tan Kiat
Dec 31, 2013

For this question, there are some pointers that we can work with :

As each numerator of the fractions in A A is present in the denominator of the fractions in B B , except 2014. Hence, after cancellations, A B = 1 2014 AB = \frac{1}{2014} .

In addition, C 2 = 1 2014 C^2 = \frac{1}{2014} too.

Hence, A B = C 2 AB = C^2 ---- Equation (1)

Now, consider each terms in A A and B B : 2 3 \frac{2}{3} in B B > 1 2 > \frac{1}{2} in A A , 4 5 \frac{4}{5} in B B > 3 4 > \frac{3}{4} in A A , ... until 2012 2013 \frac{2012}{2013} in B B > 2011 2012 > \frac{2011}{2012} in A A . Note that the term 2013 2014 \frac{2013}{2014} in A A is not compared. With the following information :

As every term in B B > its corresponding term in A A except 2013 2014 \frac{2013}{2014} .

Hence, B B > A A' , where A A' denotes all the terms except 2013 2014 \frac{2013}{2014} .

Now as 2013 2014 A = A \frac{2013}{2014}A' = A => A > A A' > A . Hence , as B B > A A' > A A , B > A \boxed{B > A}

In addition, referring back to equation (1) , A B = C 2 AB = C^2 , as the product of A A and B B yields the product of C C and itself, hence, logically, C C must lie between A A and B B for that to occur. Thus, as B B > A A , hence, B > C > A \boxed{B > C > A}

Let A = a /(2014*b) B = b/a Use cross multiplication comparisons and result in B > C > A

Alek Nelson - 5 years, 3 months ago
용철 고
Dec 31, 2013

A=1/2 3/4 ...2013/2014=3/2 5/4 ...2013/2012 1/2014=1/B 1/2014 Then AB=1/2014=C^2 It implies A<C<B or B<C<A B>1 then 1/B<1 also A=1/B*2014<1/2014<1 Hence A<C<B

Alok Kumar
Feb 15, 2016

It is a gp

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