849 second challenge

x 2 + y 2 = 849 x 2 y 2 {x}^{2}+{y}^{2}=849-{x}^{2}{y}^{2}

Find all possible x x values to the equation above such that x x and y y are both positive integers. And state the values of x x in ascending order with no spaces in between (e.g. if the solutions were 2 2 , 55 55 and 13 13 you would write " 21355 21355 ").


The answer is 24713.

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4 solutions

Sophie Maclean
Apr 7, 2015

Seeing as someone asked, this is my solution.

x 2 + y 2 = 849 x 2 y 2 {x}^{2}+{y}^{2} = 849 - {x}^{2}{y}^{2}

x 2 y 2 + x 2 + y 2 = 849 {x}^{2}{y}^{2} + {x}^{2}+{y}^{2} = 849

x 2 y 2 + x 2 + y 2 + 1 = 850 {x}^{2}{y}^{2} + {x}^{2}+{y}^{2} + 1 = 850

( x 2 + 1 ) ( y 2 + 1 ) = 850 ({x}^{2}+1)({y}^{2}+1)=850

The pairs of factors of 850 can now be considered.

850 = 1 × 850 850= 1\times 850

850 = 2 × 425 850= 2\times 425

850 = 5 × 170 850= 5\times 170

850 = 10 × 85 850= 10\times 85

850 = 17 × 50 850= 17\times 50

850 = 25 × 34 850= 25\times 34

It is clear that there are two occasions when both in the pair are one more than a square number so the possible solutions are:

x 2 + 1 = 5 {x}^{2}+1=5 and y 2 + 1 = 170 {y}^{2}+1=170 (and vice versa)

or x 2 + 1 = 17 {x}^{2}+1=17 and y 2 + 1 = 50 {y}^{2}+1=50 (and vice versa)

Therefore x = 2 x=2 or 13 13 or 4 4 or 7 7 .

Of course, I had the advantage that I wrote the question for a friend with certain techniques in mind, though it is great to see other methods that I hadn't considered!

Nice question and solution. One suggestion, though; I think you will need to add that y y must be an integer as well, for as presently stated we can find a real number y y for any given positive integer x x that will satisfy the equation. :)

Brian Charlesworth - 6 years, 2 months ago

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If y is allowed to be a positive real number the number of solutions rises and x cqn be one of: 1 , 2 , 3 , 4 , 7 , 13 1,2,3,4,7,13

So @Sophie add in the condition that y is a positive real number as well.

Sualeh Asif - 6 years, 2 months ago

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That was my first attempt, but then I realized that for any positive integer x x we can find a positive real value y y that satisfies the equation. To obtain Sophie's posted solution, it will need to be specified that y y must be an integer.

Brian Charlesworth - 6 years, 2 months ago

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@Brian Charlesworth Thank you both - I have edited it and hope this clears up any ambiguity. I forgot to specify that y y must also be an integer!

Sophie Maclean - 6 years, 2 months ago

@Brian Charlesworth Actually I wasted two tries because too! Thankyou for clearing the ambiguity

Sualeh Asif - 6 years, 2 months ago

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@Sualeh Asif Sorry! I guess it's all very well thinking of a problem but you have to write down properly :) pleas let me know if there are any ambiguities

Sophie Maclean - 6 years, 2 months ago

i just wrote an algorithm.. i hope its easy..

include <stdio.h>

include <math.h>

int main() { float n,m,i,j; int flag; for(i=0;i<30;i++){ flag=0; n = (849-(i i))/(1+(i i)); m=sqrt(n); j = (int)m; if(m>0 && j==m) flag=1; if(flag==1) printf("%d\n",(int)i ); } return 0; }

Shubham Agrawal - 6 years, 2 months ago

Thanks for writing this up.

Bill Bell - 6 years, 2 months ago

x 2 + y 2 = 849 x 2 y 2 x^2+y^2=849-x^2y^2

x 2 + y 2 + x 2 y 2 = 849 x 2 y 2 + x 2 + y 2 + 1 = 850 ( x 2 + 1 ) ( y 2 + 1 ) = 850 \Rightarrow x^2+y^2+x^2y^2=849 \\ \quad x^2y^2 + x^2+y^2+ 1=850 \\ \quad (x^2+1)(y^2+1) = 850

We can use a spreadsheet to do the computation. Mine is as follows:

We note that x = { 2 , 4 , 7 , 13 } x=\{ 2,4,7,13\} . Therefore, the required answer is 24713 \boxed{24713}

Bill Bell
Apr 7, 2015

In the first quadrant, the maximum values of x x and y y are both less than 30.

It's a simple matter to check the space of integer values of x x and y y for those that adhere to this relation.

How did the author of the problem do it?

PS: Incidentally, this way of providing for solutions of problems opens up a lot of possibilities!

I really like this method - not being able to code very well myself I am always impressed with answers like this. I have now also posted my own solution if you'd like to see an entirely different way of doing it.

Sophie Maclean - 6 years, 2 months ago

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I've been writing code for some many years that I have difficulty thinking in any other way.

Bill Bell - 6 years, 2 months ago

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