A little rolling sphere

A small solid steel sphere of total mass 0.1 kg 0.1~\mbox{kg} and radius 1 cm 1~\mbox{cm} rolls without slipping with an initial speed v i v_i on a table. It eventually rolls onto a thin sheet of paper. As the ball is moving on the paper you suddenly move the paper horizontally at a speed of 1 m/s 1~\mbox{m/s} for 2 seconds 2~\mbox{seconds} perpendicular to initial velocity of the sphere. The sphere may slip on the paper during this time. You then stop the paper, the sphere keeps rolling/slipping, but eventually rolls off the paper back onto the table. When the sphere is back to rolling without slipping on the table, it has a final speed v f v_f . What is v f / v i v_f/v_i ?

Details and assumptions

  • The coefficients of static and kinetic friction of the paper with the sphere are μ s = 0.5 \mu_s=0.5 and μ k = 0.4 \mu_k=0.4 .


The answer is 1.

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5 solutions

Josh Silverman Staff
Nov 26, 2013

Experiment

The easiest way to evaluate this question is simply to ask your girlfriend to kindly pull a rough pillow case under a softball as it rolls in a straight line along a measuring tape on camera as you listen to elevator music. Then you check that the average velocity for the entire trip is in close agreement with the velocity you measure from the end of the pillow case to the end of the measuring tape, taking care to ensure the ball maintains straight line motion for the entire trip.

video video

Using this method I found the entire trip (110.5 cm) to occur in 27 24th's of a second while the trip from the end of the pillow case to the 110.5 cm mark (45 cm) to occur in 11 24th's of a second resulting in the average velocity of 98.2 cm/s for the whole trip and 98.18 cm/s for the second half. To within the accuracy of my experimental setup, which I haven't calculated but I am sure is much more than this difference, these speeds are identical.

Theory

Another, less exciting, way is to use theoretical physics.

Leaving aside the forward velocity of the ball (which will give rise to some interesting patterns with a marker placed on the surface of the steel sphere) let us consider what happens to a ball pulled from rest on a piece of paper.

At the beginning of the pull, the ball has no translational or angular velocity which means that it will slip until its linear velocity is synced to its angular velocity, i.e. when v = ω R \displaystyle \displaystyle v=\omega R . The interface of the ball and paper is slipping, so the paper grips the ball with kinetic friction, given by μ k m g \displaystyle \mu_k mg . As long as the two surfaces are slipping, the force of friction pulls the ball along with the paper. During this phase of motion, the ball accelerates according to v ˙ = μ k g \displaystyle \dot{v} = \mu_k g . Similarly, the force of friction applies a torque to the ball which provides angular acceleration so that the angular velocity evolves as I ω ˙ = μ k g R \displaystyle I\dot{\omega} = \mu_k g R . This phase of acceleration with slipping will proceed until v = ω R \displaystyle v=\omega R at which point the ball will roll uniformly.

In our example, the ball starts out with no angular velocity along the axis perpendicular to the pull of the paper and no translational velocity along the pull of the paper. The paper is pulled at velocity v 0 \displaystyle v_0 . We have

ω ( t ) = ω 0 + μ k g R I t = ω 0 + 5 μ k g 2 R t \displaystyle \begin{aligned} \omega(t) &= \omega_0 + \frac{\mu_k g R}{I} t\\ &= \omega_0 + \frac{5\mu_k g}{2R}t \end{aligned}

and

v ( t ) = v 0 + μ k g t \displaystyle v(t) = v_0 + \mu_kgt

Let us move from the lab frame into the frame of the paper where it is convenient to calculate. This shift leaves the angular velocity unchanged and changes the initial velocity of the ball from zero to v 0 \displaystyle v_0 (to the left)

Setting v ( t ) = ω ( t ) R \displaystyle v(t) = \omega(t)R we find t \displaystyle t^* , the time at which the ball begins to roll uniformly:

v 0 μ k g t = R 5 μ k g 2 R t v 0 = μ k g t ( 1 + 5 2 ) t = 2 v 0 7 μ k g \displaystyle \begin{aligned} v_0 - \mu_kgt &= R\frac{5\mu_kg}{2R}t \\ v_0 &= \mu_kgt\left(1+\frac52\right) \\ t^* &= \frac{2v_0}{7\mu_kg} \end{aligned}

With the values given in the problem statement, this happens at t 0.073 sec \displaystyle t \approx 0.073 \mbox{ sec} , well before the 2 sec \displaystyle 2 \mbox{ sec} pulling window is over. For the rest of the window, the ball rolls uniformly with angular velocity ω ( t ) = 5 μ k g 2 R 2 v 0 7 μ k g = 5 7 v 0 R \displaystyle \omega(t^*) = \frac{5\mu_k g}{2R}\frac{2v_0}{7\mu_kg} = \frac57\frac{v_0}{R} counterclockwise. The translational velocity of the ball is given by v 0 + μ k g 2 v 0 7 μ k g \displaystyle -v_0 + \mu_kg \frac{2v_0}{7\mu_kg} to the left relative to the paper.

Moving back into the lab frame (where the paper is stationary), this is μ k g 2 v 0 7 μ k g = 2 7 v 0 \displaystyle \mu_kg \frac{2v_0}{7\mu_kg} = \frac27 v_0 to the right. Concretely, the ball moves with velocity v = 2 7 v 0 \displaystyle v=\frac27 v_0 to the right, relative to the ground and rotates with angular velocity 5 7 v 0 R \displaystyle \frac57\frac{v_0}{R} counterclockwise.

This proceeds until the two second mark at which point the paper stops and the ball starts to skid across the paper to the right while rotating counterclockwise. At this point we have the same problem as before in which the paper grips the ball with kinetic friction. This will proceed until the linear velocity and the angular velocity are synced.

We have v 0 = 2 7 v 0 \displaystyle v_0 = \frac27 v_0 and ω 0 = 5 7 v 0 R \displaystyle \omega_0 = \frac57\frac{v_0}{R} .

These values evolve according to ω ( t ) = ω 0 μ k g R I t v ( t ) = v 0 μ k g t \begin{aligned}\displaystyle \omega(t) &= \omega_0 - \frac{\mu_k g R}{I} t \\ v(t) &= v_0 - \mu_kgt\end{aligned}

I.e.

ω ( t ) = 5 7 ω 0 μ k g R I t v ( t ) = 2 7 v 0 μ k g t \begin{aligned}\displaystyle \omega(t) &= \frac57 \omega_0 - \frac{\mu_k g R}{I} t \\ v(t) &= \frac27 v_0 - \mu_kgt\end{aligned}

Solving v ( t ) = ω ( t ) R \displaystyle v(t) = \omega(t)R we find that these are matched at t = 2 7 v 0 μ k g \displaystyle t^* = \frac27\frac{v_0}{\mu_kg} . However, this is the point where both quantities are precisely zero, which implies that the whole tug-of-war ends as it started off… at rest.

This shows that the effect of the paper pulling is simply to spin the ball up to a uniform rotation and translation which dissipate perfectly at the end of pulling. Nothing about the process of the paper pulling does anything to affect the energy of the original rolling motion and so, that energy is unchanged and v i / v f = 1 v_i/v_f=1 .

Inference

Yet another way is to perform a meta-analysis of the problem on its own. This was actually my original method of solution.

It is very hard for me to believe that the paper pulling can contribute or dissipate any overall energy to/from the ball in such a way that no matter what the value of the starting energy, the spinning would have the same relative effect on the overall energy of the ball, i.e. on the value of v i / v f \displaystyle v_i/v_f .

For this reason, I assigned the belief that for a problem such as this, the actual value of the initial velocity would be important given that the paper affects the final velocity to be P ( v i important paper does something ) = 0.95 \displaystyle \mbox{P}(v_i \mbox{ important}|\mbox{ paper does something}) = 0.95 . Similarly, I assigned P ( v i un-important paper does nothing ) = 0.99 \displaystyle \mbox{P}(v_i \mbox{ un-important}|\mbox{ paper does nothing}) = 0.99 .

Before thinking about the problem I was indifferent to the v i \displaystyle v_i mattering so P ( v i important ) = 0.5 \displaystyle \mbox{P}(v_i \mbox{ important}) = 0.5 .

I wouldn't be blown away if the paper did something and v i \displaystyle v_i wasn't shown so

P ( paper does something v i not shown ) = 0.1 \displaystyle \mbox{P}(\mbox{paper does something}|v_i\mbox{ not shown}) = 0.1

but I wouldn't be surprised at all if v i \displaystyle v_i was shown and the paper didn't do a thing... so

P ( paper does something v i not shown ) = 0.5 \displaystyle \mbox{P}(\mbox{paper does something}|v_i\mbox{ not shown}) = 0.5 .

My belief that the paper does something should then be given by

P ( paper does something ) = P ( paper does something v i not shown ) P ( v i not shown ) P ( v i not shown v i paper does something ) = 0.1 × 0.5 0.95 \displaystyle \displaystyle \mbox{P}(\mbox{paper does something}) = \frac{\mbox{P}(\mbox{ paper does something}|\mbox{ }v_i\mbox{ not shown})\mbox{P}(v_i\mbox{ not shown})}{\mbox{P}(v_i \mbox{ not shown}|\mbox{ }v_i\mbox{ paper does something})} = \frac{0.1\times0.5}{0.95}

and that the paper does nothing 0.5 × 0.5 0.05 \displaystyle \displaystyle \frac{0.5\times0.5}{0.05} giving the normalized belief of 1.04 % \displaystyle 1.04\% that the paper matters and 98.96 % \displaystyle 98.96\% that the paper doesn't matter. Given this very strong belief, I inferred that the paper left the ball's velocity unchanged and thus v i / v f = 1 \displaystyle v_i/v_f = 1 .

Cute. The only problem is that your experiment is measuring the wrong thing. It is clear that moving the paper/pillow-case sideways has no effect on the component of velocity in the original direction of motion, and so the component of velocity in that direction is bound to be unchanged. The issue is whether the ball picks up a transverse velocity component, and you do not measure that. Maybe your girlfriend could tug harder on the pillow-case, to give a greater sideways deviation to the ball?

Mark Hennings - 7 years, 6 months ago

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Cute.

I admit that some of the inspiration for the experimentation was to boost the cute factor/to deliver the trifecta solution.

Maybe your girlfriend could tug harder on the pillow-case, to give a greater sideways deviation to the ball?

Revisions will be underway as soon as some time clears up. In further trials with a rubber ball and paper starting from rest on my desk, I observed some cleaner results re:stopping that may supplant this original line of inquiry. In any case I will endeavor to improve my kitchen/lab space and address the effect.

Josh Silverman Staff - 7 years, 6 months ago

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An alternative metasolution might be the following. The effect of the paper is to impart transverse motion, independently of the size of the original velocity. Thus the final velocity must be v i i + w j v_i\mathbf{i} + w\mathbf{j} where w w is independent of v i v_i . Since the question implies that v f v i = v i 2 + w 2 v i \frac{v_f}{v_i} = \frac{\sqrt{v_i^2 + w^2}}{v_i} is knowable without being given the exact value of v i v_i , the only possibility is w = 0 w=0 , making the ratio 1 1 .

Mark Hennings - 7 years, 6 months ago

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@Mark Hennings That is a really nice argument.

Josh Silverman Staff - 7 years, 6 months ago

@Mark Hennings It is indeed. Can you show that the ratio of speeds is one, even if I move the paper in an arbitrary manner in the horizontal plane?

David Mattingly Staff - 7 years, 6 months ago

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@David Mattingly Rather than repeating myself, please borrow the notation of my own post.

Suppose that the velocity of the paper is V \mathbf{V} at time t t , where V k = 0 \mathbf{V} \cdot \mathbf{k} = 0 . We shall assume that the paper is stationary initially, moves for a while, and then stops moving again. Thus V = 0 \mathbf{V} = \mathbf{0} when t = 0 t=0 , and there exists T T such that V = 0 \mathbf{V} = \mathbf{0} for all t T t \ge T . Then the friction force experienced by the ball is zero if v C = V \mathbf{v_C} = \mathbf{V} (the ball is then rolling on the paper), and is of magnitude μ k m g \mu_kmg , pointing in the same direction as V v C \mathbf{V} - \mathbf{v_C} , if v C V \mathbf{v_C} \neq \mathbf{V} (the ball is sliding on the paper). I shall write this force as F \mathbf{F} , noting that F k = 0 \mathbf{F} \cdot \mathbf{k} = 0 . This force acts at the point of contact of the ball with the paper. The equations of motion of the system are then m v ˙ = F I ω ˙ = a k F m\mathbf{\dot{v}} \; = \; \mathbf{F} \qquad I\mathbf{\dot{\omega}} \; = \; -a\mathbf{k} \wedge \mathbf{F} and hence we deduce that ω ˙ ( a k ) = a 2 I ( k F ) k = a 2 I F \begin{array}{rcl} \mathbf{\dot{\omega}}\wedge(-a\mathbf{k}) & = & \frac{a^2}{I} (\mathbf{k} \wedge \mathbf{F}) \wedge \mathbf{k} \\ & = & \frac{a^2}{I}\mathbf{F} \end{array} since F k = 0 \mathbf{F} \cdot \mathbf{k} = 0 . Thus we deduce that v C ˙ = v ˙ + ω ˙ ( a k ) = ( 1 m + a 2 I ) F = 7 2 m F \begin{array}{rcl} \mathbf{\dot{v_C}} & = & \mathbf{\dot{v}} + \mathbf{\dot{\omega}} \wedge (-a\mathbf{k}) \\ & = & \big(\frac{1}{m} + \frac{a^2}{I}\big)\mathbf{F} \; = \; \frac{7}{2m}\mathbf{F} \end{array} and hence v C ˙ = 7 2 v ˙ \mathbf{\dot{v_C}} \; = \; \tfrac72\mathbf{\dot{v}} Since, initially, v C = 0 \mathbf{v_C} = \mathbf{0} and v = v i i \mathbf{v} = v_i\mathbf{i} , we deduce that v = v i i + 2 7 v C \mathbf{v} \; = \; v_i\mathbf{i} + \tfrac27\mathbf{v_C} Since the paper stops moving, the ball will stop sliding eventually! Thus a time T 1 T T_1 \ge T will be reached when V = 0 \mathbf{V} = \mathbf{0} and v C = 0 \mathbf{v_C} = \mathbf{0} for all t T 1 t \ge T_1 . This means that v = v i i \mathbf{v} = v_i\mathbf{i} for all t T 1 t \ge T_1 . Thus, no matter how the paper is moved, the ball ends up with the same velocity as it started with.

Mark Hennings - 7 years, 6 months ago

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@Mark Hennings I didn't quite well understand your proof at present (I will read it once more later) , it's an awesome conclusion!!!!

Aniket Sanghi - 4 years, 8 months ago

@Mark Hennings Can't we say it directly as when the sheet is moved at suppose 120° . Then we analysed everything in that direction only (independently) .The component in the initial direction will change but would it have any affect ?

Rolling + Rolling would be rolling only .

I mean like at any moment like final the initial velocity is changing like vi - v

and angular velocity like w° - w. Then we can say for rolling vi - v = w°R - wR

so we see that it becomes v = wR

So we see that we can independently deal that direction even if it is not perpendicular as it won't affect we can vectorially add this to initial !

To sum up , I mean that if we take that 120° direction as another direction and deal with it independently and satisfy rolling in this direction then rolling + rolling will be rolling only na ( By mathematics also )

Am I right sir ??

@Mark Hennings

Aniket Sanghi - 4 years, 8 months ago

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@Aniket Sanghi OK the rolling condition provides a relationship between velocity, angular velocity and the radius of the sphere (I presume you mean the radius when you write R). This is kinematics. Where are the dynamics?

Mark Hennings - 4 years, 8 months ago

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@Mark Hennings Actually I have taken 2 independent directions one in initial direction and the other in 120° , you can say I took a different coordinate system. So, then i applied all dynamics and kinematics in this direction , in the other direction its pure rolling(no slipping) so no friction along that direction .

If we can take component of friction in 120° direction then we can see it will be responsible for changing the new gained velocity's component only , it won't affect the initial velocity (as it is not causing slipping) so its no effect if we take component of new velocity and friction

So , we can just analyse the situation in these 2 directions and add vectorially the final answers .

Am I going right sir? @Mark Hennings

Aniket Sanghi - 4 years, 8 months ago

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@Aniket Sanghi You have just stated two relationships between the velocity components and the angular velocity components, without explaining why they are related like that. That is where you are missing the dynamics.

Mark Hennings - 4 years, 8 months ago

Where I say we have v 0 = 2 7 v 0 v_0 = \frac27 v_0 I meant to say v 0 = 2 7 v 0 v_0' = \frac27 v_0 where v 0 v_0' is the velocity of the ball just before the paper stops.

Finally, where I wrote P ( paper does something v i not shown ) = 0.5 \displaystyle \mbox{P}(\mbox{paper does something}|v_i\mbox{ not shown}) = 0.5 I meant to write P ( paper does nothing v i not shown ) = 0.5 \displaystyle \mbox{P}(\mbox{paper does nothing}|v_i\mbox{ not shown}) = 0.5 .

Josh Silverman Staff - 7 years, 6 months ago
Jatin Yadav
Nov 26, 2013

Let us say motion's plane is X Y X-Y and initially, the ball's velocity( v 0 \vec{v_{0}} ) was along X X -axis ( i ^ \hat{i} ), Clearly, ω 0 \vec{\omega_{0}} was along j ^ \hat{j} . Clearly, v 0 = ω 0 R v_{0} = \omega_{0}R , R \vec{R} is from center to bottom point.

f = μ k m g j ^ \vec{f} = \mu_{k} mg \hat{j}

Hence, a = μ k g j ^ \vec{a} = \mu_{k} g \hat{j}

Similarly, taking moment , angular acceleration = α = R × f 2 5 m R 2 = 5 2 μ k g R i ^ \vec{\alpha} = \frac{\vec{R} \times \vec{f}}{\frac{2}{5}mR^2} = \frac{5}{2}\frac{\mu_{k}g}{R} \hat{i} ,

Thus, v c m = v 0 i ^ + μ k g t j ^ \vec{v_{cm}} = v_{0} \hat{i} + \mu_{k}gt \hat{j} ,

ω = 5 2 μ k g t R i ^ + ω 0 j ^ \vec{\omega} = \frac{5}{2}\frac{\mu_{k}gt}{R} \hat{i} + \omega_{0} \hat{j}

Now, v b o t . = v c m + w × R \vec{v_{bot.}} = \vec{v_{cm}} + \vec{w} \times \vec{R}

= 7 2 μ k g t j ^ \frac{7}{2} \mu_{k} gt \hat{j} ,

When friction ceases , v b o t = v p a p e r = 1 j ^ \vec{v_{bot}} = \vec{v_{paper}} = 1 \hat{j}

Hence, after t = 2 7 μ k g 0.073 s t = \frac{2}{7 \mu_{k} g} \approx 0.073 s , friction is 0., when v j ^ = 2 7 m / s , ω i ^ = 5 7 R v_{\hat{j}} = \frac{2}{7} m/s, \omega_{\hat{i}} = \frac{5}{7R}

Now, when paper is stopped, v p a p e r = 0 v_{paper} = 0 , v b o t = 1 j ^ v_{bot} = 1 \hat{j} , hence, now friction would be along j ^ -\hat{j} , again having magnitude μ k m g \mu_{k} mg .

Now, from above, we saw that v b o t \vec{v_{bot}} will be changed only along j ^ \hat{j} as the force and torque by friction is tending to change only i ^ \hat{i} component of ω \vec{\omega} .Hence, we can reduce our math to scalar where ω \omega and v v have fixed directions, we won't be considering other directions because along them , changes aren't taking place.In the following , the component of a a and v v discussed is along ± j ^ \pm \hat{j} and ω \omega and α \alpha in ± i ^ \pm \hat{i} .Let us change t = 0 t=0 to the point when paper is stopped.

As done before, we can easily make equations,(taking ω i ^ \omega_{\hat{i}} and v j ^ v_{\hat{j}} +ve)

a = μ k g a = -\mu_{k}g ,

α = 5 2 μ k g R \alpha = -\frac{5}{2} \frac{\mu_{k} g}{R}

v = 2 7 μ k g t v = \frac{2}{7} - \mu_{k}gt

ω = 5 7 R 5 2 μ k g R \omega = \frac{5}{7R} - \frac{5}{2} \frac{\mu_{k} g}{R}

v b o t . = v + ω R = 0 t 0 = 2 7 μ k g v_{bot.} = v + \omega R = 0 \Rightarrow t_{0} = \frac{2}{7 \mu_{k}g} is the time when pure roll. begins. Now , v t 0 = 0 v_{t_{0}} = 0 , on substituting values.

Hence , finally, v = v 0 i ^ \vec{v} = v_{0} \hat{i} , ratio = v 0 v 0 = 1 \frac{v_{0}}{v_{0}} = \boxed{1}

the given question doesnt require calculations at all check my solution

Milun Moghe - 7 years, 6 months ago

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It requires calculations .

Isn't this a mere guess?? "friction force will act in opposite direction to the initial direction of friction which will again cause slipping until the gained angular velocity and velocity of center of mass become zero in a direction where the paper is pulled"

It requires a mathematical proof, isn't possible that v v and ω \omega are not 0 0 simultaneously, and still the body is rolling without slipping?

jatin yadav - 7 years, 6 months ago

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it is simply that effects due to friction will cause the sphere to gain or loose same amount of a certain rotational kinetic and translational kinetic in equal intervals of time.

Milun Moghe - 7 years, 6 months ago

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@Milun Moghe after 2 seconds friction will act in the opposite direction irrespective of whether it had started rolling or not . in both cases tendency of motion of the lowermost point on the sphere relative to the ground after 2 seconds is the initial direction of friction force

Milun Moghe - 7 years, 6 months ago

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@Milun Moghe without mathematics, you can't say that frictional effects EXACTLY balance , you can only say friction changes its direction , but that exact balancing its initial effect after changing direction is explained by mathematics

jatin yadav - 7 years, 6 months ago

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@Jatin Yadav V'=u+at V"=v'-at

Same with angular freq whatever it may be v"=u

Because the frictional force has same magnitude but opposition direction finally velocity is bound to be zero along with angular acceleration

Milun Moghe - 7 years, 6 months ago

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@Milun Moghe Jatin im sorry to be offencive . i should have had respect of your solution to. What are your regards on this.

The frictional force has no net torque about the lowermost point . so the angular momentum about the lowermost point is always conserved irrespective of how or in which direction in the plane the paper is pulled or with how much velocity it is pulled

Milun Moghe - 7 years, 6 months ago

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@Milun Moghe to finally angular momentum about the lowermost point is the same as initial

Milun Moghe - 7 years, 6 months ago

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@Milun Moghe That would have been a good idea indeed, but i always feared the uniqueness of a point, there are infinite points which regularly come at bottom.

Better statement was:

Angular momentum is conserved about any fixed point on floor along the line of action of friction.

jatin yadav - 7 years, 6 months ago
Shikhar Jaiswal
Mar 9, 2014

WHEN THE SPHERE ROLLS ONTO THE PAPER

THE PAPER IS PULLED FROM UNDER IT IMMEDIATELY......THIS SUGGESTS THAT THERE WILL BE

SLIPPING BETWEEN THE PAPER AND THE SPHERE IN THE DIRECTION IN WHICH IT IS PULLED

LET THE VELOCITY ACQUIRED BY THE SPHERE BE v c m v_{cm} AND THE ANGULAR VELOCITY BE ω \omega

NOW...LINEAR IMPULSE PROVIDED BY FRICTION

p = m v c m μ k m g t = m v c m p=mv_{cm} \Rightarrow \mu_{k}mgt=mv_{cm}

v c m = 8 m / s \Rightarrow v_{cm}=8m/s

ANGULAR IMPULSE PROVIDED BY FRICTION

J = I c m ω μ k m g t R = I c m ω J=I_{cm}\omega \Rightarrow \mu_{k}mgtR=I_{cm}\omega

ω = 2000 r a d / s \Rightarrow \omega=2000rad/s

ONCE AGAIN SEE THAT THE SPHERE SLIPS IN THE DIRECTION IN WHICH THE PAPER HAS BEEN PULLED WHILE IT ROLLS IN THE OTHER DIRECTION

HENCE FRICTION WILL ACT ONLY IN THE DIRECTION IN WHICH THE SPHERE SLIPS

ie-THE DIRECTION IN WHICH THE PAPER WAS PULLED

ALSO OBSERVE THAT THE DIRECTIONS OF v c m v_{cm} and ω \omega ARE OPPOSITE

NOW...........ANGULAR MOMENTUM ABOUT THE POINT OF CONTACT OF SPHERE WITH THE

PAPER WILL ALWAYS BE CONSERVED (AS NET TORQUE ABOUT THAT POINT IS ZERO )

L i = L f \Rightarrow L_{i}=L_{f}

L i = I c m ω + m ( v c m ) R L_{i}=I_{cm}\omega+m(-v_{cm})R

I c m = 2 5 m R 2 I_{cm}=\frac {2}{5}mR^2

L i = 0 L f = 0 \Rightarrow L_{i}=0 \Rightarrow L_{f}=0

THIS IS ONLY POSSIBLE IF v c m f i n a l = R ω f i n a l = 0 v_{cmfinal}=R\omega_{final}=0

THIS CLEARLY MEANS THAT AFTER A LONG TIME THE SPHERE HAS STOPPED ALL MOTION IN THE DIRECTION IN WHICH THE PAPER WAS PULLED

WHILE IT IS STILL IN A STATE OF PURE ROLLING IN ITS ORIGINAL DIRECTION OF MOTION

v i = v f \Rightarrow \boxed{v_{i}=v_{f}}

but there can be another simple solution as there is no external force in the horizontal direction so momentum is conserved

Sahaj Srivastava - 7 years, 3 months ago

sry shikhar but i agree with sahaj

Albnewt Sahaj - 7 years, 3 months ago
Mark Hennings
Nov 26, 2013

Let i , j , k \mathbf{i},\mathbf{j},\mathbf{k} be a right-handed orthonormal triad of vectors, with i , j \mathbf{i},\mathbf{j} both horizontal, with i \mathbf{i} pointing in the initial direction of travel of the ball, and k \mathbf{k} pointing vertically upwards. The initial velocity of the centre of mass of the bass is v = v i i \mathbf{v} \,=\, v_i\mathbf{i} , and the initial angular velocity of the ball is ω = ω i j \mathbf{\omega} \,=\, \omega_i\mathbf{j} , where v i = a ω i v_i \,=\, a\omega_i , where a a is the radius of the ball. This last rolling condition ensures that the point on the ball in contact with the table is stationary, since it has velocity v C = v + ω ( a k ) = v i i a ω i j k = 0 \mathbf{v}_C \; = \; \mathbf{v} + \mathbf{\omega} \wedge (-a\mathbf{k}) \; = \; v_i\mathbf{i} - a\omega_i\mathbf{j}\wedge \mathbf{k} \; = \; \mathbf{0}

When the paper starts to move, and while the ball continues to slide on the paper, the ball is subject to a friction force μ k m g j \mu_k mg\mathbf{j} acting at the point of contact of the ball with the paper, where m m is the mass of the ball, and hence we have the two equations of motion m v ˙ = μ k m g j I ω ˙ = a k μ k m g j = a μ k m g i m\mathbf{\dot{v}} \; = \; \mu_k mg\mathbf{j} \qquad I\mathbf{\dot{\omega}} \; = \; -a\mathbf{k} \wedge \mu_k mg\mathbf{j} \; = \; a\mu_kmg\mathbf{i} where I = 2 5 m a 2 I = \tfrac25ma^2 is the moment of inertia of the ball about its centre. Thus v C ˙ = v ˙ + ω ˙ ( a k ) = μ k g ( 1 + m a 2 I ) j = 7 2 μ k g j \mathbf{\dot{v_C}} \; = \; \mathbf{\dot{v}} + \mathbf{\dot{\omega}} \wedge (-a\mathbf{k}) \; = \; \mu_k g \big(1 + \tfrac{ma^2}{I}\big)\mathbf{j} \; = \; \tfrac72\mu_kg \mathbf{j} This shows us that the motion of the paper relative to the point of contact with the ball is always in the direction of the vector j \mathbf{j} , and so the friction force continues to point along the vector j \mathbf{j} . Thus we deduce that v C = 7 2 μ k g t j = 1.4 g t j \mathbf{v_C} \; = \; \tfrac72 \mu_k g t\mathbf{j} \; = \; 1.4gt \mathbf{j} and this model is valid for 0 t 1 1.4 g < 2 0 \le t \le \tfrac{1}{1.4g} < 2 , at which time v C = j \mathbf{v_C} = \mathbf{j} , with v = v i i + 2 7 j ω = 5 7 a i + ω i j \mathbf{v} \; = \; v_i\mathbf{i} + \tfrac27\mathbf{j} \qquad \mathbf{\omega} \; = \; \tfrac{5}{7a}\mathbf{i} + \omega_i\mathbf{j} The ball is now simply rolling on the moving paper. The key point to note is that the sliding stops (well) before the 2 2 seconds of paper movement are up.

When the paper stops moving, this is effectively applies the same friction forces as before, but in the opposite direction, so that the ball is now subject to a sideways force of μ k m g j -\mu_k mg\mathbf{j} , acting at the point of contact with the table, and the ball will slide on the table top until v C \mathbf{v_C} returns from j \mathbf{j} to 0 \mathbf{0} . Considering the above calculations, this means that a total of 2 7 j \tfrac27\mathbf{j} will be subtracted from the velocity v \mathbf{v} , and so the ball's velocity will change from v i i + 2 7 j v_i\mathbf{i} + \tfrac27\mathbf{j} back to v i i v_i\mathbf{i} , so that v f = v i v_f = v_i , and hence v f v i = 1 \frac{v_f}{v_i} = 1 .

If you solve for the time it takes for the ball to decelerate you also get that ω \omega goes to zero. I think that result is important (if the ball skids to v j = 0 v_j=0 but is still rotating, it could then further decelerate its rotation until it rolls without slipping and reverse direction giving a non-zero v j v_j ).

Josh Silverman Staff - 7 years, 6 months ago

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No. The angular velocity is never zero, since the ball is rotating when it is rolling, and the ball never comes to rest (it always as a nonzero component in the i \mathbf{i} direction). The ball rolls when v C = v + ω ( a k ) = 0 \mathbf{v_C} \; = \; \mathbf{v} + \mathbf{\omega}\wedge (-a\mathbf{k}) = \mathbf{0} namely when the point of contact of the ball with the ground is (instantaneously) stationary.

I did solve for the behaviour of the angular velocity!

Obviously, if v \mathbf{v} were zero, but ω \mathbf{\omega} were not, the ball would start to move again. This is exactly what happens if you strike a pool ball in a head-on collision with either top-spin or bottom-spin. Immediately after the collision, the cue ball is stationary, but spinning. The friction between the ball and the baize caused by the spin then makes the cue ball either head on forward or cut back. Interesting swerve effects are created when the angular velocity is not simply horizontal and perpendicular to the direction of travel.

Mark Hennings - 7 years, 6 months ago

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I should have specified, change ω \omega to ω j \omega_j .

Josh Silverman Staff - 7 years, 6 months ago
Milun Moghe
Nov 27, 2013

As initially the sphere is rolling the point of contact is not moving wrt the paper so the frictional force doesnt effect the initial anqular velocity component in its direction. there will be an additional angular velocity in the perpendicular direction as friction force is always perpendicular to the initial direction of velocity of center of mass of the sphere . We can take this situation as super imposing the sphere rolling in one direction and slipping and rolling in the direction in which the paper is pulled. The effect of the friction will cause the sphere to roll after some time in both directons. and after 2 sec friction force will act in opposite direction to the initial direction of friction which will again cause slipping untill the gained angular velocity and velocity of center of mass become zero in a direction where the paper is pulled. so finally the sphere moves in the same direction as before rolling with the same velocity of the center of mass.* Even if the sphere doesnt start rolling in the direction perpendicular to its initial velocity before 2 seconds still after two seconds the effect of friction will be opposite irrispective of whether the ball rolls or not.* so the ratio of final to initial velocity is independent of the time the paper is pulled so no calculation is required


it is simply that effects due to friction will cause the sphere to gain or loose same amount of a certain rotational kinetic and translational kinetic in equal intervals of time.

after 2 seconds friction will act in the opposite direction irrespective of whether it had started rolling or not . in both cases tendency of motion of the lowermost point on the sphere relative to the ground after 2 seconds is the initial direction of friction force**

Milun Moghe - 7 years, 6 months ago

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