Suppose u , v , and w are the roots of polynomial f ( x ) = x 3 + 2 0 x 2 + 1 3 x + 4 2 , and u 1 , v 1 , and w 1 are the roots of polynomial g ( x ) = x 3 + r x 2 + s x + t . If g ( 1 ) = b a , where a and b are coprime positive integers, what is the value of a + b ?
This problem is posed by Ahaan Rungta .
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I converted this comment into a solution, because it elegantly demonstrates how choosing the correct perspective on a problem could greatly simplify the work that needs to be done. Compare it with other solutions which use Vieta's formula to justify g ( x ) .
I don't get this solution, is there a proof for it? (switching the coefficients)
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Consider f ( x ) = 0 , with w as a root, thus, f ( w ) = a ( w ) 3 + b ( w ) 2 + c ( w ) + d . Dividing by w 3 1 throughout, you get w 3 f ( w ) = a + w b + w 2 c + w 3 d Hence, a + w b + w 2 c + w 3 d = a + b ( w 1 ) + c ( w 2 1 ) + d ( w 3 1 ) = d ( x ) 3 + c ( x ) 2 + b ( x ) + a for an equation with roots w 1
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Great job. Using the substitution w = x 1 allows us to transform the roots directly. This works for many other cases, as long as the resultant can be made into a polynomial (of the same degree).
If α i are the roots of f ( x ) , what polynomial g ( x ) has roots 2 α i + 3 ?
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@Calvin Lin – Is it 2 f ( x ) + 3 ?
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@Sameer L. – Can you test your guess?
Does it work for the polynomial f ( x ) = x which has a root of 0 ?
Does it work for the polynomial f ( x ) = x ( x − 1 ) ?
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@Calvin Lin – Calvin Lin is it we have to substitute (x-3)/2 in place of x in f(x) to get g(x) ??
May I know how do you prove it? Thanks.
Wow!
You made a coment on Noor muhammad's solution 3 days, 12 hours ago, and you post this solution 1 day 22 hours ago right now. I think we are not allowed to do that
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Actually, I converted his comment into a solution, to illustrate how having the correct perspective on a problem could simplify it greatly.
My apologies, I'd add in an explanation.
This is very elegant! However, although we barely use the actual roots in this solution, I do dislike having x as a root and a variable. I myself did not see this solution, and instead went the well-trodden path of Vieta's.
Elegant solution for this problem! When I submitted it, I used the Vieta's solution. Nice job. Upvoted. Out of curiosity, which level was this problem in?
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It was level 4 problem 2
Given
f
(
x
)
=
x
3
+
2
0
x
2
+
1
3
x
+
4
2
Let u, v, w be the roots of the polynomial, then according to Vieta's Formula,
u
+
v
+
w
=
−
2
0
u
v
+
u
w
+
v
w
=
1
3
u
v
w
=
−
4
2
Now, the required polynomial is
g
(
x
)
=
x
3
+
r
x
2
+
s
x
+
t
with roots
u
1
v
1
w
1
Applying Vieta's Formula on this polynomial we have:
u
1
+
v
1
+
w
1
=
−
r
u
v
w
v
w
+
u
w
+
u
v
=
−
r
Using values of expressions;
−
4
2
1
3
=
4
2
−
1
3
= -r
r
=
4
2
1
3
Also for t,
v
1
.
u
1
.
w
1
=
−
t
u
v
w
1
=
−
t
Substituting value for uvw we have;
−
4
2
1
=
−
t
t
=
4
2
1
Also for s,
u
v
1
+
u
w
1
+
v
w
1
=
s
u
v
w
w
+
v
+
u
=
s
Substituting values for u+v+w and uvw we have;
s
=
−
4
2
−
2
0
s
=
4
2
2
0
Now,
By substituting the values for r, s and t in polynomial g(x) we have;
g
(
x
)
=
x
3
+
4
2
1
3
x
2
+
4
2
2
0
x
+
4
2
1
Therefore,
g
(
1
)
=
1
+
4
2
1
3
+
4
2
2
0
+
4
2
1
g
(
1
)
=
4
2
4
2
+
1
3
+
2
0
+
1
=
4
2
7
6
=
2
1
3
8
=
>
a
=
3
8
,
b
=
2
1
a
+
b
=
3
8
+
2
1
a
+
b
=
5
9
A
n
s
w
e
r
It seems like everyone approached this using Vieta's. There isn't a need to do so. How does g ( x ) relate to f ( x ) ? Do you see a quick way to go from f ( x ) to g ( x ) ?
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If the function f ( x ) = a x 3 + b x 2 + c x + d has roots w , x , and y , then the function g ( x ) with roots w 1 , x 1 , and y 1 can be represented by g ( x ) = d x 3 + c x 2 + b x + a .
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Perfect! This allows you to skip all of the steps shown in these solutions.
By Vieta's Theorem in f ( x ) yields:
Using Vieta's Theorem in g ( x ) also yields;
We must solve for r, s, and t to determine the value of g ( 1 )
First solving for r,
u 1 + v 1 + w 1 = u v w u v + v w + w u = − 4 2 1 3 = − 4 2 1 3 = − r
Therefore, r = 4 2 1 3
Solving for s,
u v 1 + v w 1 + w u 1 = u v w u + v + w = − 4 2 − 2 0 = 4 2 2 0 = s
Lastly, solving for t, u v w 1 = − 4 2 1 = − t
Therefore, t = 4 2 1
We are now able to solve for g ( 1 ) ,
g ( 1 ) = 1 3 + r ( 1 2 ) + s ( 1 ) + t = 1 + r + s + t = 1 + 4 2 1 3 + 4 2 2 0 + 4 2 1 = 4 2 7 6 = 2 1 3 8
Therefore
a = 3 8 , b = 2 1
and
a + b = 59
Start from the factorisation of the two polynomials:
f ( x ) = ( x − u ) ( x − v ) ( x − w )
g ( x ) = ( x − u 1 ) ( x − v 1 ) ( x − w 1 )
From there, just multiply g ( 1 ) by f ( 0 ) = u v w
g ( 1 ) = ( 1 − u 1 ) ( 1 − v 1 ) ( 1 − w 1 )
u v w g ( 1 ) = − ( 1 − u ) ( 1 − v ) ( 1 − w )
− f ( 0 ) g ( 1 ) = − f ( 1 )
g ( 1 ) = 4 2 7 6 = 2 1 3 8
The solution is therefore 3 8 + 2 1 = 5 9
Because u 1 is a root of g ( x ) , we get:
g ( u 1 ) = u 3 1 + u 2 1 + u s + t = 0
Multiplying by 4 2 u 3 we get:
4 2 t u 3 + 4 2 s u 2 + 4 2 r u + 4 2 = 0
Because f ( u ) = u 3 + 2 0 u 2 + 1 3 u + 4 2 = 0 , the unknown coefficients can be determined by:
4 2 t = 1 4 2 s = 2 0 4 2 r = 1 3
t = 4 2 1 s = 4 2 2 0 r = 4 2 1 3
g ( 1 ) = 1 + r + s + t = 1 + 4 2 1 3 + 4 2 2 0 + 4 2 1 = 2 1 3 8
a + b = 3 8 + 2 1 = 5 9
By Vieta's formulas, we can conclude that u + v + w = − 2 0 , u v + u w + v w = 1 3 and u v w = − 4 2 .
By Vieta's again for g ( x ) :
u 1 + v 1 + w 1 = u v w u v + u w + v w ⟹ − 4 2 1 3 ∴ r = 4 2 1 3
u v 1 + u w 1 + v w 1 = u v w u + v + w ⟹ 4 2 2 0 ∴ s = 4 2 2 0
u v w 1 = − 4 2 1 ∴ t = 4 2 1
So, g ( x ) = x 3 + 4 2 1 3 x 2 + 4 2 2 0 x + 4 2 1
When x = 1 , g ( x ) = 2 1 3 8 = b a , so a + b = 5 9
put 1/x at f(x)
we get 1/x^3 + 20/x^2 + 13/x +1
42x^3 + 13x^2 + 20x +1
divided /42
g(x) = x^3 + 13/42 x^2 + 20/42 x + 1/42
g(1) = 38/21
a+b =59
f ( x ) = x 3 + 2 0 x 2 + 1 3 x + 4 2 So a = 1 , b = 2 0 , c = 1 3 , d = 4 2 u + v + w = a − b = − 2 0 u v w = a − d = − 4 2 u v + u w + v w = a c = 1 3 u v w w v + u v w u w + u v w u v = u 1 + v 1 + w 1 = 4 2 − 1 3 u v w 1 = 4 2 − 1 u v w w + u v w v + u v w u = u v 1 + u w 1 + v w 1 = − 4 2 − 2 0 = 2 1 1 0 g ( x ) = x 3 + r x 2 + s x + t So a = 1 , b = r , c = s , d = t u 1 + v 1 + w 1 = a − b = − r = 4 2 − 1 3 from which r = 4 2 1 3 u v w 1 = a − d = − t = 4 2 − 1 from which t = 1 4 2 u v 1 + u w 1 + v w 1 = a c = s = 2 1 1 0 from which s = 2 1 1 0 thus g ( x ) = x 3 + 4 2 1 3 x 2 + 2 1 1 0 x + 4 2 1 and g ( 1 ) = 1 + 4 2 1 3 + 2 1 1 0 + 4 2 1 which equals g ( 1 ) = 2 1 3 8 but g ( 1 ) = b a = 2 1 3 8 Hence a + b = 3 8 + 2 1 = 5 9
I will generalize the problem:
Suppose u , v , w are the roots of polynomial f ( x ) = x 3 + a x 2 + b x + c , where c = 0 and u 1 , v 1 , w 1 are the roots of polynomial g ( x ) = x 3 + r x 2 + s x + t Find the coefficients of g ( x ) in terms of a , b , c .
By Vieta on f , we know that u + v + w u v + u w + v w u v w = − a , = b , = − c . (eqn. 1) (eqn. 2) (eqn. 3)
By Vieta on g , we know that − r s − t = u 1 + v 1 + w 1 = u v w u v + u w + v w , = u v 1 + u w 1 + v w 1 = u v w u + v + w , = u v w 1 . (eqn. A) (eqn. B) (eqn. C) Substituting ( eqn. 2 ) and ( eqn. 3 ) into ( eqn. A ) gives r = − u v w u v + u w + v w = − − c b = c b . Substituting ( eqn. 1 ) and ( eqn. 3 ) into ( eqn. B ) gives s = u v w u + v + w = − c − a = c a . Substituting ( eqn. 3 ) into ( eqn. C ) gives t = − u v w 1 = − − c 1 = c 1 . Therefore, g ( x ) = x 3 + ( c b ) x 2 + ( c a ) x + c 1 .
In this problem, we have g ( 1 ) = 1 + r + s + t = 1 + c b + c a + c 1 = 1 + 4 2 1 3 + 4 2 2 0 + 4 2 1 = 2 1 3 8 as our answer.
Motivation: Well, this is a pretty basic Vieta's formulas exercise, you know stuff about the roots and coefficients.
SHOOT I'M DUMB.
According to Vieta's Formula, u + v + w = − 1 2 0 = − 2 0 , u v + u w + v w = 1 1 3 = 1 3 , u v w = − 1 4 2 = − 4 2 . Therefore, − 1 r = u 1 + v 1 + w 1 = u v w u v + u w + v w = − 4 2 1 3 , r = 4 2 1 3 1 s = u v 1 + u w 1 + v w 1 = u v w u + v + w = − 4 2 − 2 0 , s = 2 1 1 0 . − 1 t = u v w 1 = − 4 2 1 , t = 4 2 1 . Thus, g ( 1 ) = 1 3 + 4 2 1 3 ( 1 2 ) + 2 1 1 0 ( 1 ) + 4 2 1 = 2 1 3 8 , a + b = 3 8 + 2 1 = 5 9
From the polynomial, we say that
-20 = u + v + w
13 = uv + vw + wu
-42 = uvw
And...
-r =
u
1
+
v
1
+
w
1
=
u
v
w
u
v
+
v
w
+
w
u
=
−
4
2
1
3
r =
4
2
1
3
s =
u
v
1
+
v
w
1
+
w
u
1
=
u
v
w
u
+
v
+
w
=
−
4
2
−
2
0
=
2
1
1
0
s =
2
1
1
0
-t =
u
v
w
1
=
−
4
2
1
t =
4
2
1
Therefore, g(x) =
x
3
+
4
2
1
3
x
2
+
2
1
1
0
x +
4
2
1
then, g(1) = 1 +
4
2
1
3
+
2
1
1
0
+
4
2
1
=
2
1
3
8
=
b
a
Thus, a + b =
5
9
Since u , v , w are the roots of f ( x ) then:
By substituting 1 to the right coeffiecient of f ( x ) we can get:
a. u + v + w = − 2 0
b. u v + v w + u w = 1 3
c. u v w = 4 2
Using the same method for g ( x ) , we can derive:
u 1 + v 1 + w 1 = − r
u v 1 + v w 1 + u w 1 = s
u v w 1 = − t
By solving 1 , 2 , 3 using a , b , c we can get:
r = − u v w u v + u w + v w = 4 2 1 3
s = u v w u + v + w = 4 2 2 0
t = − u v w 1 = 4 2 1
Then g ( 1 ) = 1 + 4 2 1 3 + 4 2 2 0 + 4 2 1 = 4 2 7 6 = 2 1 3 8
Since 3 8 and 2 1 are coprime positive integers, then a + b = 5 9
Correction : u v w = − 4 2
I do not understand what "By substituting 1 to the right coefficient of f ( x ) " means.
The statements follow simply by comparing coefficients, which likely is what you mean.
From Vieta's Formuals we know that:
u + v + w = a − b = − 2 0
u v + v w + u w = a c = 1 3
w u v = a − d = − 4 2
Using the same ideas for g ( x ) :
u 1 + v 1 + w 1 = u v w v u + u w + u v = − 4 2 1 3 = − r → r = 4 2 1 3
( u 1 ∗ v 1 ) + ( w 1 ∗ u 1 ) + ( w 1 ∗ v 1 ) = w u v v + u + w = 4 2 2 0 = s → s = 4 2 2 0
u 1 ∗ v 1 ∗ w 1 = u v w 1 = − 4 2 1 = − d → d = 4 2 1
g ( x ) = x 3 + 4 2 1 3 x 2 + 4 2 2 0 x + 4 2 1
g ( 1 ) = 1 + 4 2 3 4 = 4 2 7 6 = 2 1 3 8 ⟹ 3 8 + 2 1 = 5 9
Using Vi e ta's relations,we get,
For f ( x ) , u + v + w = − 2 0 , u v + u w + v w = 1 3 & u v w = − 4 2 .
For g ( x ) , u 1 + v 1 + w 1 = − r = u v w u v + v w + u w = > 4 2 1 3 = r .
and u v 1 + u w 1 + v w 1 = s = u v w u + v + w = > 2 0 / 4 2 = s .
Also, u v w 1 = − t = > t = 4 2 1 .
Therefore, g ( 1 ) = 1 + r + s + t = 1 + 4 2 1 3 + 4 2 2 0 + 4 2 1 = 2 1 3 8 , which gives required answer as: 3 8 + 2 1 = 5 9
From "de vieta's formula", u + v+ w = - 20, uv + vw + wu = 13, uvw=-42 And again \frac {1}{u} + \frac {1}{v} + \frac {1}{w} = - r \Rightarrow \frac {uv + vw + wu}{uvw} = -r \Rightarrow r= \frac {13}{42}
\frac {1}{uv} + \frac{1}{vw} + \frac{1}{wu} = s \Rightarrow \frac {u + v + w}{uvw}=s \Rightarrow s = \frac {10}{21}
\frac {1}{uvw} = - t \Rightarrow r = \frac {1}{42}
So g(1) = 1 + r + s + t =1 + \frac {13}{42} + \frac {10}{21} + \frac {1}{42} = \frac {38}{21} Our ans is \boxed{59}
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If the function f ( x ) = a x 3 + b x 2 + c x + d has roots w , x , and y , then the function with roots w 1 , x 1 , and y 1 can be represented by d x 3 + c x 2 + b x + a .
Since we want g ( x ) to have a leading coefficient of 1 , we divide by d = 4 2 to get
g ( x ) = x 3 + 4 2 1 3 x 2 + 4 2 2 0 x + 4 2 1
Hence, g ( 1 ) = 4 2 7 6 = 2 1 3 8 , and thus a + b = 5 9 .