An Expected Value

Tamara chooses an integer x x uniformly at random from 1 1 to 425. 425. She then chooses an integer y y uniformly at random from 1 , 2 , , x . 1,2,\ldots ,x. What is the expected value of y ? y?


The answer is 107.

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13 solutions

Aditya Parson
May 20, 2014

Tamara can choose 425 425 numbers from 1 1 to 425 425 .

Let x i x_i denote the number selected such that x 1 = 1 , , x 425 = 425 x_1=1, \ldots , x_{425}=425 .

The expected value of y y is the average of all the expected values of y i y_i for every corresponding x i x_i .

We calculate that E ( y 1 ) = 1 , E ( y 2 ) = 1.5 , E ( y 3 ) = 2 , . . . . , E ( y 425 ) = 213 E (y_1)=1, E(y_2)=1.5, E (y_3)=2,...., E (y_{425})=213

And,

E ( y ) = 1 425 i = 1 425 E ( y i ) E (y)=\frac {1}{425} \displaystyle \sum_{i=1}^{425} E (y_i)

E ( y ) = 1 425 425 ( 1 + 213 2 ) E (y)=\frac {1}{425} \cdot 425 \cdot (\frac {1+213}{2}) [Note that the summation yields this expression since first term is 1 1 and the last 425 425 with common difference 0.5 0.5 ].

Hence, E ( y ) = 107 E (y) =\boxed { 107}

The correct interpretation of this problem is to apply conditional expectation, namely E [ Y ] = P ( X i ) E [ Y X i ] . E[Y] = \sum P(X_i) E[ Y | X_i ].

Calvin Lin Staff - 7 years ago
Jeremy Kong
May 20, 2014

For a given x x , E ( y ) = i = 1 x i x = x ( x + 1 ) 2 x = x + 1 2 \displaystyle E(y) = \frac{\sum_{i=1}^x i}{x} = \frac{\frac{x(x+1)}{2}}{x} = \frac{x+1}{2} .

Since x x is uniform randomly selected from integers in [ 1 , 425 ] [1, 425] , the probability that x x takes on any unique integer value in the specified interval is 1 425 \frac{1}{425} .

Consequently we have E ( y ) = n = 1 425 n + 1 2 425 = n = 1 425 n + 1 850 E(y) = \displaystyle \frac{\sum_{n=1}^{425} \frac{n+1}{2}}{425} = \frac{\sum_{n=1}^{425} n+1}{850} = 425 × 426 2 + 425 850 = 1 × 426 2 + 1 2 = 214 2 = 107 = \frac{\frac{425 \times 426}{2} + 425}{850} = \frac{\frac{1 \times 426}{2} + 1}{2} = \frac{214}{2} = \boxed{107} .

I don't understand any of these weird signs in your solution but I still managed to solve the problem.

Shubham Bhargava - 5 years, 10 months ago

Jajaja, I just don't get anything. After reafing this I'd still saying X=4 because Y is a ranfom uniform number from 1,2,...,x, therefore, if there is only one gap from 2 to x means y=3 and x=4 😂😂 Does it make sense to you?

Gerard Calvo Bartra - 4 years, 9 months ago
John Chang
May 20, 2014

The expected value of y for a given x is (x+1)/2. Sum this for 1<=x<=425, and divide by 425 to get the overall average. Here are some terms: 1/425*(1+1.5+2+... 426/2). There are 425 terms, each term averaging 214/2 (pair up the first and last terms, 2nd & 424th etc), so the total is 214/2 = 107.

Calvin Lin Staff
May 13, 2014

When Tamara chooses the number x , x, the expected value of y y is x + 1 2 . \frac{x+1}{2}. Thus, the expected value of y y is the expected value of x + 1 2 \frac{x+1}{2} as x x ranges uniformly from 1 1 to 425. 425. By linearity of expectation, E [ y ] = E [ x + 1 2 ] = E [ x ] + 1 2 . E[y] = E[\frac{x+1}{2}] = \frac{E[x] + 1}{2}. Since E [ x ] = 425 + 1 2 = 213 , E[x] = \frac{ 425+1}{2} = 213, hence E [ y ] = 213 + 1 2 = 107. E[y] = \frac{213+1}{2} = 107.

What is the topic of this subject?

Figel Ilham - 6 years ago

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The topic is already stated to be Combinatorics.

If you want to know the skill, you can click on "What do I need to know" or "Learn how to solve problems like this".

Calvin Lin Staff - 6 years ago

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I mean the subtopics.

Figel Ilham - 6 years ago

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@Figel Ilham If you click on the links, it will bring you down to the exact skill, and you can thus get the subtopic and chapter.

Calvin Lin Staff - 6 years ago

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@Calvin Lin Okay, thanks sir. But it says Brilliant2. Do you have any other ways to become Brilliant 2 instead of using the plastic? Maybe voucher or transfer?

Figel Ilham - 6 years ago

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@Figel Ilham You should still be able to click on it, and it (currently) will redirect you to the skill. For a non B^2 member, you would see:

Hence, it is Combinatorics -> Probability -> Expected Value -> Linearity of Expectation. (Note that not all problems have this functionality, just the popular ones.)

Calvin Lin Staff - 6 years ago

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@Calvin Lin Thanks a lot, master.

Figel Ilham - 6 years ago

Finally a well explained answer!!

Awais Khan - 5 years, 1 month ago
Lokesh Sharma
Jun 21, 2015

By Iterated Expectation theorem:

E [ Y ] = E [ E [ Y X ] ] E[Y] = E[E[Y|X]]

Considering this problem,

E [ Y X = x ] = 1 + x 2 E[Y|X=x] = \frac{1+x}{2}

(The above is true because Y Y is Uniform Distribution which takes values between 1 1 and x x .

In general the expected value of random variable X X having Uniform Distribution is a + b 2 \frac{a+b}{2} where X X takes values from a a to b b .)

Therefore, in general case where X X can take any value,

E [ Y X ] = 1 + X 2 E[Y|X] = \frac{1+X}{2}

Now,

E [ Y ] = E [ E [ Y X ] ] E[Y] = E[E[Y|X]]

= E [ 1 + X 2 ] = 1 2 + 1 2 E [ X ] = E[\frac{1+X}{2}] = \frac{1}{2} + \frac{1}{2}E[X]

(by Linearity of Expectation )

= 0.5 + 0.5 1 + 425 2 = 107 = 0.5 + 0.5 * \frac{1+425}{2} = 107

Mirko Očkin
Aug 28, 2016

a + 3 4 \frac{a+3}{4} where a = 425

Generally, when L is number of chooses (how deep): a + 2 L 1 2 L \frac{a+2^L-1}{2^L}

Albert Cho
May 20, 2014

Firstly, to find the expected value of x, I multiplied the probability of each number being picked by the value of that number. Since each number has the probability of being picked P(x) = 1/425, and retains its own integer value, the expected value of x is (1/425) (1 + 2 + 3 ... + 424 + 425) = (425 426)/(425*2) = 213.

Essentially doing the same process with y except now P(y) = 1/213, we get the expected value of y as (1/213) * (1 + 2 + 3 + .... + 212 + 213) = (213 214)/(213 2) = 107.

Therefore the EV of y is 107.

First of all we need to find E ( x ) E(x) . E ( x ) = ( 1 + 2 + 3 + . . . . . . . . . . . . + 425 ) / 425 = ( 425 426 ) / ( 2 425 ) = 213 E(x)=(1+2+3+............+425)/425 =(425*426)/(2*425) =213 . Now, E ( y ) = ( 1 + 2 + 3 + . . . . . . . . . . + 213 ) / 213 = ( 213 214 ) / ( 2 213 ) = 107 E(y)=(1+2+3+..........+213)/213 =(213*214)/(2*213) =107 . Hence the expected value of y = 107 y= \underline{107} .

This is the most common mistake made, which shows that students didn't understand the concept of expected value. They claim that "the expected value of X X is 213 ), hence E ( Y ) = ( 1 + 2 + + 213 ) / 213 E(Y) = (1 + 2 + \ldots + 213) / 213 ."
On what basis is this claim true?
What happens if the expected value of X X is 212.5 instead (like when we chose an integer from 1 to 424?
How do we stop taking the sum at a half integer?


Calvin Lin Staff - 7 years ago
Plinio Sd
Dec 20, 2017

If a random variable is uniformly distributed in { 1 , 2 , , n } \{1,2,\dots,n\} , then its expected value is given by k = 1 n k n = n + 1 2 \sum_{k=1}^{n}\frac{k}{n} = \frac{n+1}{2} . Then, we use that to write E [ Y ] = E [ E [ Y X ] ] = E [ 1 + X 2 ] = 1 + 1 + 425 2 2 = 107. \mathbb{E}[Y] = \mathbb{E}[\mathbb{E}[Y|X]] = \mathbb{E}\left[\frac{1+X}{2}\right] = \frac{1+\frac{1+425}{2}}{2} = 107.

Bill Bell
Jul 23, 2015

Just a tease.

Oliver Welsh
May 20, 2014

To find the expected value of x, you must find the median value of x: \frac {415 + 1}{2} = 213 Now, we do the same to find the expected value of y: \frac {213 + 1}{2} = 107 Therefore, the expected value for y is 107.

Hendra Tandoyo
May 20, 2014

The expected value of x = 1 + 425 2 = 213 x = \frac{1+425}{2} = 213 then the expected value of y = 1 + 213 2 = 107 y = \frac{1+213}{2} = 107

Chandan Kumar
May 20, 2014

Here we have to understand the language of problem statement. Choosing a random number from 1 to 425, "UNIFORMLY". Here uniformly means at constant differences. So the series formed will be A.P

Hence applying (x)=(d/2) (2 a+(n-1)*d) where S(x) is the sum of series up-to n d is the constant difference.

Here, S(x)=(1/2) (2 1+(425-1)*1)=213

Now, Once again we have to repeat the process, because selection of number choosing "UNIFORMLY" at random is repeated for new value of n(previous result). S'(x)=(1/2) (2 1+(213-1)*1)=107

here, we have answer as 107.

* The same problem can be for other than uniformly, it can be G.P

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