Circular track

A small block of mass 0.0500 kg slides in a vertical circle of R = 0.800 m on the inside of circular track . There is no friction between the track and block . At the bottom of the block's path, the normal force the track exerts on the block has magnitude 3.40 N. What is the magnitude of the normal force in Newtons that the track exerts on the block when it is at the top of its path ?

Take g = 9.8 m / s 2 g = 9.8 m / s^2 .


The answer is 0.457.

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4 solutions

Maedhros 777
Dec 29, 2013

At the bottom of the track, the normal force on the block is upward, gravity acts downward, and the net centripetal force is upward, so n m g = m v 2 R n - mg = \frac{mv^2}{R} . Plugging in the given values, we find that v = R ( n m g ) m = ( 0.8 ) ( 3.40 ( 0.05 ) ( 9.8 ) ) 0.05 6.8235 v = \sqrt{\frac{R(n-mg)}{m}} = \sqrt{\frac{(0.8)(3.40-(0.05)(9.8))}{0.05}}\approx 6.8235 m/s. Using conservation of energy between the bottom and top parts of the loop, we know that 1 2 m v 2 = m g Δ y + 1 2 m v t o p 2 \frac{1}{2}mv^2 = mg\Delta y + \frac{1}{2}mv_{top}^2 where Δ y = 2 R \Delta y = 2R : 1 2 v 2 = 2 g R + 1 2 v t o p 2 \frac{1}{2}v^2 = 2gR + \frac{1}{2}v_{top}^2 v t o p = 2 ( 1 2 v 2 2 g R ) = ( 6.8235 ) 2 4 ( 9.8 ) ( 0.8 ) 3.899 m / s v_{top} = \sqrt{2(\frac{1}{2}v^2 - 2gR)} = \sqrt{(6.8235)^2 - 4(9.8)(0.8)} \approx 3.899 m/s At the top of the loop, the normal force on the block acts downward, so n + m g = m v t o p 2 R n + mg = \frac{mv_{top}^2}{R} . Now we find that n = m v t o p 2 R m g = ( 0.05 ) ( 3.899 ) 2 0.8 ( 0.05 ) ( 9.8 ) 0.46 N n = \frac{mv_{top}^2}{R} - mg = \frac{(0.05)(3.899)^2}{0.8} - (0.05)(9.8) \approx \boxed{0.46 N} .

Thank you

AAditya Barot - 7 years, 5 months ago

I did the same...

Kishan k - 7 years, 5 months ago

did same

BHANU VISHWAKARMA - 7 years, 1 month ago

I did the same also.

satvik pandey - 6 years, 9 months ago
Tunk-Fey Ariawan
Feb 7, 2014

Let N T \,N_T and N B \,N_B be the normal force at the top and bottom of circular track, respectively. Let v T \,v_T and v B \,v_B be the normal force at the top and bottom of circular track, respectively. At the bottom of circular track, applying the Newton's 2 n d \,2^{nd} law for circular motion. N B m g = m v B 2 R m v B 2 = ( N B m g ) R , ( 1 ) \begin{aligned} N_B - mg &= m\frac{v_B^2}{R}\\ mv_B^2&= (N_B - mg)R, &&&&& (1) \end{aligned} then use the law of conservation energy for the movement of the block from the bottom to the top of circular track and plug in equation (1). We obtain 1 2 m v B 2 = m g ( 2 R ) + 1 2 m v T 2 1 2 ( N B m g ) R = 2 m g R + 1 2 m v T 2 m v T 2 = ( N B 5 m g ) R . ( 2 ) \begin{aligned} \frac{1}{2}mv_B^2&=mg(2R)+\frac{1}{2}mv_T^2\\ \frac{1}{2}(N_B - mg)R&=2mgR+\frac{1}{2}mv_T^2\\ mv_T^2&=(N_B - 5mg)R.&& (2) \end{aligned} Finally, use the Newton's 2 n d \,2^{nd} law for circular motion at the top of circular track and plug in equation (2). We obtain N T + m g = m v T 2 R N T + m g = N B 5 m g N T = N B 6 m g N T = 3.4 6 0.05 9.8 N T = 0.46 N \begin{aligned} N_T + mg &= m\frac{v_T^2}{R}\\ N_T + mg &=N_B - 5mg\\ N_T &=N_B - 6mg\\ N_T &=3.4-6\cdot 0.05\cdot 9.8\\ N_T &=\boxed{0.46\;\text{N}} \end{aligned} # Q . E . D . # \text{\# }\mathbb{Q}.\mathbb{E}.\mathbb{D}.\text{\#}

Let linear velocity of the block at the bottom and at the top be u and v respectively.
Therefore, total energy of the block at the bottom = 1 2 \frac{1}{2} m u 2 u^{2} + V 1 V_{1}
and that of the block at the top = 1 2 \frac{1}{2} m v 2 v^{2} + V 2 V_{2} , where m =mass of the block and V 1 V_{1} and V 2 V_{2} are potential energies at the bottom and top respectively.
Applying law of conservation of energy,
1 2 \frac{1}{2} m u 2 u^{2} + V 1 V_{1} = 1 2 \frac{1}{2} m v 2 v^{2} + V 2 V_{2}
or, m ( u 2 u^{2} - v 2 v^{2} ) = 2( V 2 V_{2} - V 1 V_{1} ) or, m ( u 2 u^{2} - v 2 v^{2} )=2 mg .(2R) or, m ( u 2 u^{2} - v 2 v^{2} )= 4 mg R
or, v 2 v^{2} = u 2 u^{2} - 4 g R .....................(i)
Now, considering forces acting at the bottom of the path, we get,
m u 2 R \frac{mu^{2}}{R} + m g = 3.40 or, m u 2 R \frac{mu^{2}}{R} = 3.4 - mg ........................(ii)
and considering forces acting on the top of the path, we get, P = m v 2 R \frac{mv^{2}}{R} - m g , where P = required normal force.
Using (i) and (ii), we get, P = 3.4 - 6 mg
Putting m = 0.0500 kg and g = 9.8 m/ s 2 s^{2} we get,
P = 0.46 N \boxed{0.46 N}




it should have been mentioned to take g=9.8 i took g=10 and got it incorrect as 0.4

aryan goyat - 5 years, 7 months ago
Luciano Riosa
Jan 5, 2014

At the top of the circle the normal force exerted by the track will be opposite to that of the sliding block; that is subject to two forces: gravity and the centrifugal force.

Hence we have

F = m × a s = m ( 1 R V h 2 g ) F=m\times a_s= m(\frac{1}{R}{V_h }^2-g)

where V h {V_h } represents the speed in the block highest position while at the bottom we know

F l = 3.4 N = m ( 1 R V l 2 + g ) F_l=3.4N=m(\frac{1}{R}{V_l }^2+g)

Subtracting the first equation from the last one we get

1) F l F = m R ( V l 2 V h 2 ) + 2 m g F_l-F=\frac{m}{R}({V_l }^2-{V_h}^2) +2mg

On the other hand, the difference in kinetic energy equals the potential one, between top and bottom, so

1 2 m ( V l 2 V h 2 ) = m g × 2 R \frac{1}{2}m({V_l }^2-{V_h}^2)=mg\times2R

that is

V l 2 V h 2 = 4 g R {V_l }^2-{V_h}^2=4gR

Then we can substitute it in the 1), obtaining at last

F = F l 4 m g 2 m g = F l 6 g F=F_l-4mg-2mg=F_l - 6g

I used a nearly identical approach, and like you I never used the value of .8m for the radius of the track. This seems counter intuitive. It's as if the size of the loop doesn't matter. Can anyone explain why the value of R doesn't matter?

David Garcia - 7 years, 5 months ago

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It's not that the value of R doesn't matter, it's that it is being used purely representationally in an equation such as 1 2 m ( V l 2 V h 2 ) = 2 m g R \ \frac{1}{2} m \ (V_l^2 - V_h^2) \ = \ 2mgR \ , which is saying that the change in kinetic energy is the negative of the change in gravitational potential energy (conservation of "total mechanical energy" in the absence of friction). You would see a difference in numerical values of the energies for different-sized loops, but that issue has been sidestepped in this approach. The change in gravitational PE is linear in "height" and since the centripetal acceleration is inversely proportional to R, the change in that acceleration is independent of the loop's radius.

Gregory Ruffa - 7 years ago

..... it may be worth noting that this result implies that the minimum (theoretical!) speed to stay on a circular vertical track without falling off is

V l m i n > 7 g R V_lmin>\sqrt{7gR}

... I dare say the roller costers builders know it.

Luciano Riosa - 7 years, 5 months ago

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For the object to stay on track at the top of the circle, F > 0. So F(lower) > 6mg And what I got in the end is minimum V(lower) > sqrt(5gR)

Can you please check and see which is correct?

Tong Choo - 7 years, 5 months ago

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OK you are right. I should have written

V s m i n V_smin .....

Thank you!

Luciano Riosa - 7 years, 4 months ago

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@Luciano Riosa Oops! (another.....) V h m i n V_hmin , of course.

Luciano Riosa - 7 years, 4 months ago

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