Drifting

"Drifting" is a method of turning in a car race. After starting the turn, the driver sharply turns the steering wheel in the opposite direction of the turn . The rear wheels, powered by the engine, continue to spin fast while the car's rear slides out from the center of the turn.

In the figure below, the driver is drifting out of a right turn, and the steering wheel is turned to the left. What should the driver do next to finish the turn and go straight?

  1. Turn the steering wheel to the right. That will line up the front wheels with the rear wheels and make the car go straight.
  2. Turn the steering wheel more to the left. That will create a torque on the car that stops the car's rotation around the vertical axis.
  3. Keep the steering wheel steady and step on the gas more strongly to get a larger forward force from the rear wheels.
  4. Keep the steering and the gas unchanged and hope for the best.
1 2 3 4

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4 solutions

Laszlo Mihaly
Oct 17, 2017

The Figure shows the forces acting on the race car. The forces acting on the front and rear wheel pairs are represented by one vector each. F F is the friction force at the front wheels. Since the front wheel is rolling freely, this force is perpendicular to the wheels. The magnitude of this force has to be less that the maximum allowed by friction, F m a x = μ s N f r o n t F_{max}=\mu_s N_{front} , where μ s \mu_s is the static friction coefficient and N f r o n t N_{front} is the weight of the car carried by the front wheels. As long as the front wheel is not slipping the driver has a good control of the car: By adjusting the steering wheel she can control the direction of this force.

F F' is the force at the rear wheels. The magnitude of this force is equal to the maximum allowed by friction, F = μ k N r e a r F'=\mu_k N_{rear} , where μ k \mu_k is the kinetic friction coefficient and N r e a r N_{rear} is the weight of the car carried by the rear wheels. The direction of this force depends on the relative speed of the spinning wheels and the speed of the circular motion of the rear of the car on the track. The driver controls the direction of this force by changing the amount of gas. For example, if throttle is fully open and the wheels are spinning really fast this force is nearly parallel to the long axis of the car.

The forces F F and F F' create a torque around the center of mass. When the car is in a stationary state (turning with a steady rate) this torque must be zero. In this state the car has an angular velocity around the vertical axis that corresponds to the clockwise rotation of the car, if viewed from the top. In order to stop turning one has to stop this angular rotation. We can conclude from the drawing that the torque from the front wheels is clockwise, whereas the torque from the rear wheels is counter clockwise. If the front wheels are turned more to the left, the torque from the front wheels will be reduced and net torque will be such that is will reduce the rate of rotation of the car.

Answers:

1 Will probably make the car to spin around.

2 Correct move. Once the car stopped rotating, do #1, and step on the gas like crazy.

3 This is a sure way to get into a spin. If the driver steps on the gas more, the magnitude of the force at the rear wheels did not change much (since they are already slipping), but its direction will be more parallel to the axis of the car. Therefor the torque from the front wheels will spin the car around.

4 This may actually work, but only if the gas is a bit reduced.

If you turn the wheel harder to the left it will go into a rotational spin and be out of control. Any drifter knows that once you have powered over into the corner and reach the crest of the corner you oversteer in the opposite direction to require your line in the straight away. If those wheels were turned any further left you would end up in a spin not a drift. Your above solution is only considering force factors and is not considering the variation of the friction coefficient. The friction is over come by the power over which causes the slide die to a loss of taction, then feathering the throttle allows you to ride the drift. When you want to come out of the drift you steer opposite to slowly regain enough friction to produce traction. I understand physics as I almost have a minor, but more importantly than that I've spent a lifetime racing and drifting. If you're going to use real world application then consider all real world variables. Thank you for your time, Sincerely, Christopher E. R. Kennerly

Christopher Kennerly - 3 years, 7 months ago

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Thanks for the comment. I do not have the same experience with this as you do, but I tried it (on snow) and I think my answer is correct. When you say that steering to further left will cause a spin: which direction will be the spin?

Laszlo Mihaly - 3 years, 7 months ago

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I know less than Christopher about torques and such - but I have been put in a position similar to this by a burst tyre. I turned the steering wheel further to the left (it felt like someone else was fighting me for it) and I hit a telegraph pole rather than an oncoming car (I'm from the UK, so drive on the left) That's why I opted for (2) - assuming I'd over-corrected. But Christopher's answer makes me think - actually, I guess I had gone into a spin - I certainly didn't straighten out. But I had also involuntarily hit the brake - I don't know if this would make a difference. But maths is maths, and real life is real life (try representing 1 dimension, or an infinite set!

(The policewoman who scooped me out of the car congratulated me on 'doing the right thing', btw)

Katherine barker - 3 years, 7 months ago

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@Katherine Barker I am sure that was a scary experience and the last thing on your mind was the "torque around the center of mass". I am glad that you instinctively did the right thing. In the current problem the conditions are different, since we assume that the the driver applies the full gas, and the rear wheels are spinning. That is the last thing you want if you have a burst tire.

Laszlo Mihaly - 3 years, 7 months ago

I looked at your comment a bit more carefully, and I think there is a misunderstanding, but we are arguing in the same direction. "Any drifter knows that once you have powered over into the corner and reach the crest of the corner you oversteer in the opposite direction to require your line in the straight away." That is what I am saying, too: oversteer in the opposite direction (to the left).

Laszlo Mihaly - 3 years, 7 months ago

3 is correct cause i did that and it worked. simple as that.

Daniel Ropala - 3 years, 7 months ago

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What was the car? Because that is the proper technique for a FWD car :)

Zako Stoyanov - 3 years, 7 months ago

It works for front wheel drive. This is not the case here.

Laszlo Mihaly - 3 years, 7 months ago

Their answer is completely wrong. I have intentionally driven this pattern both on the road and on ice, and number 2 is the correct answer.

Ralph Vitale - 3 years, 7 months ago

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We agree on 2. Thanks,

Laszlo Mihaly - 3 years, 7 months ago

You might have changed the picture a bit by drawing the car closer to the bottom of the U turn. I assumed the car is about to straighten up on the road and, thus, thought there is no need for for more drifting.

You know, I somehow get a bit angry, when you have to face a number of questions which are not fully descriptive or inconclusive or the the drawing is not precisely made. Kinda, drops me out of using brilliant.

Andrejs Zavaruhins - 3 years, 7 months ago

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Sorry for that. I did not make the drawing, a Brilliant staff person made it. Originally I illustrated the problem with a photo from Wikipedia, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drifting (motorsport)#/media/File:Team Drift.jpg. A referred to the first car as it is "about to finish the turn". That was changed when they put up the problem for the weekly contest.

Laszlo Mihaly - 3 years, 7 months ago

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The picture does not open. Did you mean this one - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drifting (motorsport)#/media/File:Comparison between two drifting_techniques.svg

Andrejs Zavaruhins - 3 years, 7 months ago

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@Andrejs Zavaruhins Sorry, here is the link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Team_Drift.jpg

Laszlo Mihaly - 3 years, 7 months ago

I know this because i play NFS a lot.

keshav bantu - 3 years, 7 months ago

The front wheels need to point to the direction where you want the car to go. As you exit a corner, releasing the throttle (in a RWD) will stop pushing the rear end to the side and straighten the car, but you also have to straighten the steering wheel (steer right in this case) pointing the front wheels towards the straight.

Lets say that you are drifting in a circle where the front wheels are turned all the way to their limit. Are you saying that it would be impossible to straighten the car since no more opposite steering is possible?

Joni-Pekka Luomala - 3 years, 6 months ago

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There are two ways of coming out of drifting, and you described the other one. I also mentioned it in my solution.

Laszlo Mihaly - 3 years, 6 months ago

I concur, #2 is mostly the correct solution. Reducing throttle while simultaneously steering towards center will end the drift. Steering further left or increasing throttle both will result in loss of control and a "spin out." The physics are incorrect because the coefficient of static friction is used soley. Drifting is a dance on the edge of dynamic and static coefficients of friction, with the front wheels (static) providing the counter torque to the sliding (dynamic) rear wheels. Too little counter torque and the slide stops, making the rear wheel coefficient become static and the car will take on the trajectory of the tangent to the curve at that point. To much torque will increase the slide, causing the rear wheels to eventually pass the front wheels at which point they become the counter torque as the front begin to slide. Important to note that increasing or decreasing throttle is the second way the static/dynamic dance can be effected, so it's not all in the steering (per the original comment).

Now, if you really want a beefy drift problem, figure this out for a four wheel drive car (with and/or without differential axles).

Jon Dickerson - 3 years, 6 months ago

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I think you are incorrect in you physics explanations. We agree that the in controlled drifting the front wheels are not sliding (coefficient of static friction applies) and the rear wheels are spinning (dynamic friction applies), but there is no dancing on the edge between the two types of frictions. The "counter torque" (counter clockwise in the drawing in my solution) is always provided by the rear wheels. The front wheels always create a clockwise torque. If you apply too much throttle, the force at the rear wheels does not change in magnitude, but its direction changes so that it becomes more parallel to the car. At that point the car will start an accelerating rotation around a vertical axis in the clockwise direction. That is because of the clockwise torque at the front wheels.

I do agree that reducing the throttle is a possible way to come out of drifting. But that does not stop the sliding of the rear wheels immediately. There is a time delay. Turning the steering wheel to the intended direction of motion is also necessary, but only after the rear wheels stopped sliding. If it is done too soon, the car will spin out.

Laszlo Mihaly - 3 years, 6 months ago
Ivan Popjanev
Nov 3, 2017

Just play a car racing game and you're done.

cough cough

Oon Han - 3 years, 7 months ago
Zako Stoyanov
Nov 1, 2017

An essential part of drifting is the voluntary loss of grip. Once established, all depends on whether the car is FWD, RWD or AWD. In this scenario it's RWD, so applying more throttle means reducing even further the already poor grip on the rear wheels, thus spinning out. Straightening the front wheels or steering them in the other direction would be even worse because they guide the car. The proper solution is to point them the way you want to go, i.e. in this case further to the left.

Albert Kirsch
Nov 2, 2017

Turning the steering wheel left is exactly what you should do in the event of a skid. I've done it on ice, thank you very much..... LOL

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