Inspired By Arjen Vreugdenhil

Algebra Level 4

{ x + y = 3 x × y = 5 \begin{cases} x+y=3 \\ x\times y=5 \end{cases}

Suppose x x and y y are two real numbers satisfying the above two relations. Then find the value of x 3 + y 3 x^3+y^3 .


Inspiration .

-18 18 No solution exists 12

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9 solutions

Nihar Mahajan
Mar 12, 2016

First let us see if there actually exist x , y R x,y\in \mathbb{R} satisfying the above equations. Hence we use the identity:

x 2 + y 2 = ( x + y ) 2 2 x y = 3 2 2 ( 5 ) = 9 10 = 1 x^2+y^2=(x+y)^2-2xy=3^2-2(5)=9-10=-1

But since x , y R x,y\in \mathbb{R} , we have x 2 + y 2 0 x^2+y^2\geq 0 and above we are getting x 2 + y 2 = 1 x^2+y^2=-1 which is less than 0 0 . Hence , a contradiction and no solution exists for the given system.

Moderator note:

Simple standard approach.

Nice use of the identity! +1 :3

Mehul Arora - 5 years, 3 months ago

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Thanks :3

And yes , you should complement people like these :)

Nihar Mahajan - 5 years, 3 months ago

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Haha, okay, will do :)

Mehul Arora - 5 years, 3 months ago

Lol Level 4 !! ??

A Former Brilliant Member - 5 years, 3 months ago

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@A Former Brilliant Member And 17 upvotes? xD

:3

Mehul Arora - 5 years, 3 months ago

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@Mehul Arora That is obvious. ..

A Former Brilliant Member - 5 years, 3 months ago

@Mehul Arora See my total upvotes :3

Nihar Mahajan - 5 years, 3 months ago

@A Former Brilliant Member Oh my God , how is it Level 4? O.o

Nihar Mahajan - 5 years, 3 months ago

Nice! Those equations look awfully similar to vietas. So I just formed a quadratic x 2 3 x + 5 x^2-3x+5 out of them, which has complex roots.

Arulx Z - 5 years, 2 months ago
Otto Bretscher
Mar 12, 2016

A M = 3 2 AM=\frac{3}{2} and G M = 5 > 2 GM=\sqrt{5}>2 , violating G M A M GM\leq AM for positive real numbers. There is no solution.

Nice observation of the violating AM-GM inequality! +1

Nihar Mahajan - 5 years, 3 months ago

But sir we can use AM-GM only when we are dealing with positive reals.

Harsh Shrivastava - 5 years, 3 months ago

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The inequality x y ( x + y 2 ) 2 xy\leq \left(\frac{x+y}{2}\right)^2 holds for all reals. If x y xy and x + y x+y are both positive, as in our case, then we can take square roots to find G M A M GM\leq AM .

Otto Bretscher - 5 years, 3 months ago

But nowhere in the question is specified about x , y x,y being p o s i t i v e positive reals... So how can we apply A M G M AM-GM inequality on x , y x,y ? Am I missing something??

Rishabh Jain - 5 years, 3 months ago

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I did not want to insult the reader's intelligence by stating the obvious.

The inequality x y ( x + y 2 ) 2 xy\leq \left(\frac{x+y}{2}\right)^2 holds for all reals. If x y xy and x + y x+y are both positive, as in our case, then we can take square roots to find G M A M GM\leq AM .

As you know, I love to submit one-line solutions, so, there is no room to state the obvious ;)

Otto Bretscher - 5 years, 3 months ago

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BTW my solution is inspired by your solution on Arjen's problem where you imagined things .. Here I imagined the rectangular hyperbola.. ;-)

Rishabh Jain - 5 years, 3 months ago

Oh man.... I'm such a noob... Sorry for troubling you. ;-) I'll delete this anyways... Thanks :-) ....
Right your solutions are awesome ...I'll take care from next time.

Rishabh Jain - 5 years, 3 months ago

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@Rishabh Jain I love your elegant solutions and all the different methods you show!

Here is a challenging problem for you! We are counting on a great solution, using Methods 1, 2, 3... ;)

Otto Bretscher - 5 years, 3 months ago

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@Otto Bretscher I already got that wrong ;-)... I applied some chemistry only to get that problem wrong .. I used perfect tetrahedral angle in methane i . e 109.5 ° i.e 109.5° and found its cos which I found to be 0.33 -0.33 .. ...... Anyways soon I'll learn chebyshev polynomials as well in my summer breaks( they've greatly amazed me).. And I'll be ready to write solutions on your problems related with it too. .. ;-)

Rishabh Jain - 5 years, 3 months ago

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@Rishabh Jain You don't need Chebychev polynomials for this one. You are right, cos ( θ 3 ) = 1 3 \cos(\theta_3)=-\frac{1}{3} . What about cos ( θ 2 ) \cos(\theta_2) ? Maybe you see a trend... ;)

Otto Bretscher - 5 years, 3 months ago

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@Otto Bretscher No I was referring to your other problems which give a feeling about your love towards Chebyshew polynomials.. ( I said this reference to writing solutions to your other related problems ).....

Ya I misinterpreted the question so I'll try it again... Thanks

Rishabh Jain - 5 years, 3 months ago

Same way :) +1

Chirayu Bhardwaj - 5 years, 3 months ago
Rishabh Jain
Mar 12, 2016

Method 1 \textbf{Method 1} We know, For real numbers x , y x,y . ( x y ) 2 0 ( x + y ) 2 4 x y 0 x y ( x + y ) 2 4 = 9 4 = 2.25 \large \begin{aligned} (x-y)^2\geq 0\\& \implies (x+y)^2-4xy\geq 0 \\&\implies xy\leq \dfrac{(x+y)^2}{4}=\dfrac 94=2.25\end{aligned} But here x y = 5 > 2.25 xy=5>2.25 - A contradiction. Hence No Solutions exist \textbf{No Solutions exist} . Method 2 \textbf{Method 2} Placing value of x x from x y = 5 xy=5 . x + 5 x = 3 x+\dfrac{5}{x}=3 x 2 3 x + 5 = 0 \implies x^2-3x+5=0 Discriminant of this equation is negative hence no real x x and as a result no real y y exist. Method 3 \textbf{Method 3} Clearly graphs of x + y = 3 x+y=3 and x y = 5 xy=5 does not give any common x , y x,y . In fact, x + y = 2 5 x+y=2\sqrt 5 is the line which is parrallel to the given line and is tangent to the curve x y = 5 xy=5 while the line in the question is at less distance than this line from origin hence no common point.

Nice use of the basic a 2 0 a R a^2\geq 0 \ \forall \ a \in \mathbb{R} inequality! +1

Nihar Mahajan - 5 years, 3 months ago
Nikkil V
Mar 12, 2016

X = 3 -Y
X x Y =(3-Y)Y = 5
Y^2 -3Y + 5
b^2 - 4ac =-11
The roots of this equation are imaginary. So there are no real solutions.



Nice approach! +0!

Mehul Arora - 5 years, 3 months ago

Good use of quadratic discriminant! +1

Nikhil , you can learn to post Latex solutions if you refer this guide . Hope to see more beautiful solutions from you! :)

Nihar Mahajan - 5 years, 3 months ago

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Thank You sir

Nikkil V - 5 years, 3 months ago

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Lol , I am not a sir. I am your friend ;-)

Nihar Mahajan - 5 years, 3 months ago

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@Nihar Mahajan Are you 15?

Nikkil V - 5 years, 3 months ago

i also did in the same way..

Aswin T.S. - 5 years, 3 months ago
Arjen Vreugdenhil
Mar 12, 2016

With a problem carrying my name, least I can do is submit an alternative solution :)

Lemma : Under the constraint x + y = c x + y = c the maximum value of x y xy for real x , y x, y occurs when x = y = c / 2 x = y = c/2 .

Application: In this case, that maximum value is x y = ( 3 / 2 ) 2 = 2 1 4 xy = (3/2)^2 = 2\tfrac14 . Therefore there are no real solutions for x y = 5 xy = 5 .

Proof of the lemma : quadratic functions have a vertex; here that is clearly a maximum, because we can make x y xy very strongly negative by letting x = x = very big number and y = 3 x y = 3-x ; finally, symmetry requires that the maximum is reached when x = y x = y . Of course there are more boring, symbolic proofs, but this is more fun.

That's a nice approach! +1

Nihar Mahajan - 5 years, 3 months ago
Ankit Nigam
Mar 12, 2016

( x + y ) 3 = x 3 + y 3 + 3 x y ( x + y ) x 3 + y 3 = ( x + y ) 3 3 x y ( x + y ) x 3 + y 3 = 18 \begin{aligned} &(x + y)^3 = x^3 + y^3 + 3xy(x + y) \\ &\therefore x^3 + y^3 = (x + y)^3 - 3xy(x + y) \\ &\therefore x^3 + y^3 = -18 \end{aligned}

But wait, let's observe the conditions given we have:-

{ x + y = 3 x × y = 5 x 3 + y 3 = 18 \begin{cases} x+y&=&3 \\ x\times y&=&5 \\ x^3 + y^3 &= &-18\end{cases}

Now observing the 3 r d 3^{rd} case we can say that x x and y y cannot be positive real number as x 3 + y 3 = 18 x^3 + y^3 = -18 . Assuming x x is negative and y y is positive such that x > y |x| > |y| , may satisfy the 3 r d 3^{rd} condition but it will not satisfy 2 n d 2^{nd} condition which says that x y = 5 xy = 5 since we have assumed x x is negative, product cannot be positive. Same goes if we assume y y negative and x x positive.

Another way that may satisfy the condition is that both x x and y y are negative. It may satisfy 3 r d 3^{rd} and 2 n d 2^{nd} condition but not 1 s t 1^{st} condition that is x + y = 3 x + y = 3 . Sum cannot be positive if both x x and y y are negative!!

Observing all the possible conditions, we can say that no real values can satisfy above conditions.

Nice approach. +1.

Mehul Arora - 5 years, 3 months ago

Squaring equation 1 we get x 2 + y 2 + 2 x y = 9 x^2+y^2+2xy=9 . From equation 2 se get that x 2 + y 2 = 1 x^2+y^2=-1 . This is not possible as square of any real number is always non-negative. Hence no real solution.

( x y ) 2 0 (x-y)^2 \ge 0

or, ( x + y ) 2 4 x y (x+y)^2 \ge 4xy

Here, 3 2 < 4.5 3^2 < 4.5 . Thus no solution exists

P C
Mar 13, 2016

From the system, we see that x x and y y are the roots of the equation X 2 3 X + 5 = 0 X^2-3X+5=0 which has no roots so the correct answer is "No solution exist"

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