I have three numbers, and the product of any two of the numbers is equal to the other remaining number: a b b c c a = c = a = b . Is it true that the three numbers must be either all 0s or all 1s?
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Just to be thoroughly clear regarding a number of comments that seem to be mixing up the terms digit and number :
If something contains the "digit" 1 then it could be 1 or -1. The digit refers to the representation of a number, as opposed to the number itself.
If a "number" is 1 then it is unambiguously 1.
I'm sorry, but I cannot agree. I get what the problem is trying to say, but this is more semantics rather than match - Both -1 and 1 are in the "1s" category, so the question is misleading. Ask it as " Is it true that the three numbers must be either all 0 or all 1, or a combination of the two"? and I would trust it more
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− 1 = 1 , it's as simple as that
I read "all 0s or all 1s" as "all equal to the value 0 or all equal to the value 1". It's a question of phrasing, certainly, but the statement is an expression of value, not quality.
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Given Stephen Melor's counter-example, this detail cannot affect the answer (which is "no"). Do you agree?
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@Adrian Self – I'm not sure what you mean by "cannot affect the answer". If "all 0s or all 1s" means "all equal to 0 or all with an absolute value of 1" then it would make the answer "yes". Agreement on that point is fundamental to solving the problem as written.
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@Brian Egedy – Ah, yes, I thought you had misinterpreted the question, making your comment have a different meaning. If you are referring to the way that the question is, in fact, intended, then I quite agree.
Yeah I think this question is more in the 'gotcha' category. The problem is that sometimes this level of pedantry leads to the correct answer and sometimes it leads to the wrong answer. And there's no to way predict which is wanted better than guessing. Re-wording the question would help.
@Bogdan C , I'd say Stephen Mellor interpreted the question correctly, because the problem stated "[...] either all 0s or all 1s?" and "1s" is the same as "+1s". I mean, one can write +2 + 4 = 6, but it's more practical to write 2 + 4 = 6., and the latter "2" is positive, even though not (actually, exacly for not having been) specified. I've interpreted the question as "do all the numbers have to be either 0s or [+]1s?". Otherwise, it'd have to specify it.
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I agree with his solution for the problem - I'm not contesting the judgement. But the phrasing of the problem I believe is misleading. And I understand the view on seeing 2 as +2. Think of it this way:"10s of thousands" doesn't mean +10.000, does it? It actually means much more than that :)
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Just a question: your example for the meaning of 10s of thousands is regarding maths or daily life expressions?
The directive "Is it true that the three numbers must be either all 0s or all 1s?" is equivalent to
Is it true that ( a , b , c ) = ( 0 , 0 , 0 ) or ( 1 , 1 , 1 ) only?
Damn I thought -1 counted as a "1s"
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So do I! and the terminus "number" inheres, that its the digit, thats meant... So, we are still right - even though, the dumb machine judges different... ;-)
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Unfortunately, digit and number are two different mathematical concepts, as the Challenge Master note states.
what if theyre all ones 1 x 1 = 1 si the answer would be yes if they're all 1
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It's true that a=b=c=1 would be a solution of the set, but the question is whether all three numbers MUST be 1s or 0s, so the answer is no.
It specifically states product meaning multiplication, it gives you two options in numbers , 1 or zero. Therefore 1x1 is one or 0x0 is 0 meaning the answer is true based on the specifics of the question
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You've misread the question. The question asked whether a=b=c=0 and a=b=c=1 are the only solutions, not whether a=b=c=0, 1 can be true or not.
Oh man, I misunderstood the question and thought that the three numbers had to be the same.
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thats exactly what i thought too. at least i know someone else made the same mistake as me!! (>_<)
To do this problem, I thought that all of the numbers must have equaled 1 or 0 because I misunderstood the question.Whoops (Just like Rune) I should have read the question more carefully. I would rate this problem a 1 because if only I read the question more carefully, I would have understood that the answer is no. At F¥first I was confused n how I was wrong but I eventually figured it out after re reading the question.
Assume that the first number and the second number is a , b respectively. Since the third number is the product of the previous two, we have the third number as a b .
In addition, the third number multiplied by the first number must equal the second number, and the third number multiplied by the second number must equal the first number. Therefore, a b ⋅ a = b and a b ⋅ b = a .
Solving these two gives b ⋅ ( a 2 − 1 ) = b ⋅ ( a + 1 ) ⋅ ( a − 1 ) = 0 and a ⋅ ( b 2 − 1 ) = a ⋅ ( b + 1 ) ⋅ ( b − 1 ) = 0 .
Solving these, using the null factor law, demonstrates that solutions include a = b = a b = 1 ; a = b = − 1 , a b = 1 ; a = 1 , b = a b = − 1 ; a = a b = − 1 , b = 1 ; and a = b = a b = 0 . Thus, a = b = a b = 1 or a = b = a b = 0 are not the only solutions.
If the question asked to solve it only with positive numbers, would it be possible?
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I'm not sure I understand your question. Clearly, ab = c, ac = b, bc = a has a solution that includes only positive numbers, a=b=c=1, but that isn't a "solution" to the question posed.
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The question asked whether a=b=c=0 and a=b=c=1 are the only 2 solutions or not.
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@Pi Han Goh – I know. I'm responding to Camila's question, which doesn't make sense to me given the original problem.
@Brian Egedy , when the question asked if it was true that the three numbers must be all 0s or all 1s, and we say no, we can point out the three numbers can be 1, -1 and -1. Could these three numbers only be positive ones, excluding 1, 1 and 1 and 0, 0 and 0? Sorry for not specifying my question.
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@Camila Fonseca – Ah, you're asking if the solution could include absolute values higher than 1. Stewart Gordon posted a proof that it can't.
Last time I checked -1 is still “all ones.” Simply an unclearly written question.
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Are you saying that − 1 = 1 ?
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Nope. I’m saying -1 is a form of one, and that the question was poorly worded.
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@Cooper Stevens – I feel like you're mixing up "number" and "digit" here. If something asks about the digit 1, then there is some ambiguity and you would be correct, but the "number" 1 can only refer to 1.
@Cooper Stevens – It's not poorly worded. You've just poorly understood. Negative one (-1) isn't "a form of one". 1 and one represents a specific positive numerical value. Negative one represents a totally different numerical value. The absolute value of both may be the same, but each are entirely different. It's like if you have one apple... Then you have 1 apple. 1=1. If you OWE someone an apple, you don't have one apple. -1≠1. A doesn't equal -A. δ doesn't equal -δ.
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@Dennis Dole – I still think the question is poorly worded. I was assuming we were in N, so I answered there are no solutions other than a=b=c=1 and a=b=c=0. It should have specified that we are working in Z, the integers. "Number" is meaningless as it means different things to different people; to me, it means natural number.
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@Filippo Malgarini – You can always assume we use terminology in their accurate mathematical sense; "number" by itself can't be natural numbers (otherwise statements like "complex numbers" do not make sense).
We can readily find all of the solutions to this.
If one of the unknowns equals 0 - without loss of generality let it be a - then from the first equation c = 0 , and from the third equation b = 0 . This combination satisfies all three equations.
If none of them is 0 , then we can divide the first equation by the second and get c a = a c ⇒ a 2 = c 2 ⇒ ∣ a ∣ = ∣ c ∣ . By symmetry, ∣ a ∣ = ∣ b ∣ = ∣ c ∣ . Taking the modulus of both sides of the first equation, this gives us ∣ a b ∣ = ∣ c ∣ ⇒ ∣ a ∣ ∣ b ∣ = ∣ c ∣ ⇒ ∣ a ∣ 2 = ∣ a ∣ ⇒ ∣ a ∣ = 1 . Of course, the last deduction is valid only because we have postulated that a = 0 . And by symmetry, ∣ b ∣ = ∣ c ∣ = 1 likewise.
It's easy to see that each equation is satisfied iff it contains an even number of − 1 s. All three equations contain the same unknowns, so this is just an even number of − 1 s among a , b and c . Thus the possible solutions are: a = b = c = 0 a = b = c = 1 a = 1 , b = c = − 1 b = 1 , a = c = − 1 c = 1 , a = b = − 1
For me it makes my head swim because it feels like when you do one it changes 😕😞🤕 PS:I got a tension headache doing this...🤔😨🤕
But it's fun
I shouldn't have assumed only positive integers..
1 × ( − 1 ) = − 1
( − 1 ) × ( − 1 ) = 1
( − 1 ) × 1 = − 1
Hence false.
Here's a really quick proof to find the counter-example in few steps. We want to find a solutions which, in particular, is not ( 0 , 0 , 0 ) . This means that all three values are different from 0 , since (WLOG) a = 0 ⇒ b = 0 ⇒ c = 0 . Now that we know that, just divide all the equations by a 2 . This has for effect to obtain the much simpler problem (defining x = a b , y = a c ) :
x = y , x y = 1
⇔ x = y , x 2 = 1
But this is problem has trivial solutions x = y = 1 and x = y = − 1 . This yields the ( 1 , 1 , 1 ) solution and also the counterexample ( 1 , − 1 , − 1 ) . Of course, permutating a,b and c we get the full set of solutions.
if we use 1 & -1.we can fill those conditions.
so,the numbers don't need to be 0s for all 1s.
by 3 equations we get a condition : a^2 = b^2 = c^2 ...which is valid for a=-1, b=-1 and c=1
It simply states that we are talking about numbers, but it's not specified what kind of numbers: can be real numbers, complex numbers or whatever else you want. So, if you know about quaternions , it's probably the first and the most obvious solution that comes into mind:
i j = k
j k = i
k i = j
After thinking a little, you can figure out some more solutions in real numbers, like combinations of number 1 and two numbers − 1 , but quaternions are probably the most classic solution to this one =)
a=(-1), b=1, c=(-1) is an example that also works. With a counterexample, we can conclude that the answer must be "no".
This is even solvable if one insists that a = b = c as the basis of the quaternions satisfy all three equations. For the quaternions, we have three distinct square roots of -1, which we name i , j , k such that i 2 = j 2 = k 2 = i j k = − 1 . It can be shown from this definition that i j = k , j k = i , k i = j , thus if we set a = i , b = j , c = k , we can have a solution to the problem in which not only are the three numbers distinct, but none of them are equal to 1, -1, or 0.
3 equations, 3 unknowns. I used the first equation to get the relation b=c/a. I substituted this relation into the third equation to get ca=c/a. solving for a=1 or -1. zero is not a solution, so the answer must be no.
Of course, the counterexample (1, -1, -1) works, but for those who couldn't just come up with it, here's how its done. Use the first and last equations to obtain that a=b/c=c/b (note that we can divide because we're ignoring the zero case). This tells us that a must then be 1 or -1 and the same holds true for b and c.
a b b c c a = c = a = b . Multiplying equations above we have ( a b c ) 3 = a b c a b c ( a b c + 1 ) ( a b c − 1 ) = 0 It is clear that either a b c = 0 , a b c = 1 or a b c = − 1 . Since the product of either 0 or 1 can never yield negative value. So it's false
( − 1 , − 1 , 1 ) , ( − 1 , 1 , − 1 ) , ( 0 , 0 , 0 ) , ( 1 , − 1 , − 1 ) , ( 1 , 1 , 1 )
The answer is no because they if these numbers are all 0s or 1s. It can't be because thr numbers are three different numbers: a,b and c.
Are you saying that a , b , c must be distinct numbers?
An imaginary solution: (i, -i, 1)
It all depends on the triangle of multiplication of positives and negatives.
With this, it becomes easy to visualize the negative cases.
One mistake that people might have done is to try the positive numbers instead of realizing that -1 and 1 are two different numbers. I was going to commit the same mistake but before saying yes, I realized that the numbers can also be negative. Thus, by trying out (-1, -1, 1), you will find that
1X(-1)=-1 (a=1, b=-1 and c=-1)
-1X(-1)=1 (b=-1, c=-1 and a=1)
1X(-1)=-1 (a=1, c=-1 and b=-1)
clearly not, but a^2=b^2=c^2 which 0 and 1 satisfies
Multiplicative inverse identity.
What about this identity?
Let's all take a step back and think about the problem: "I have three numbers, and the product of any two of the numbers is equal to the other remaining number:" So, slow down and just look at the wording. "The Product of any two numbers(xy) is equal to(=) the other remaining number (z)" By definition no matter what single-digit, or multi-digit number you substitute for the variable, the statement is true. Therefore, it does, in fact, not need to be either a zero "0" or a one "1" in order for the statement to be true.
There is absolutely NO math involved in solving this particular problem. The only thing that you need is the ability to read without bias. Don't assume meanings based on context of socially asserted preferences. Read the statement as absolutely literal as you can.
Really, this is the very first step to any solution. Filter out bias, where possible.
Therefore, it does, in fact, not need to be either a zero "0" or a one "1" in order for the statement to be true.
How do you know that?
ab = c _(1) ,bc = a _(2)
Dividing (1) by (2) we get a/c = c/a which is true for all 1s but not for 0s as 0/0 is undefined .
You're wrong. Clearly a = b = c = 0 is a solution.
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A counter example: ( 1 , − 1 , − 1 )
Hence, it is disproven.