Push it away

A solid cylinder of mass m = 5 kg m=5\text{ kg} rests on two supports of the same height, as shown. One support is rough and stationary while other is a smooth plank of the same mass placed on a smooth, horizontal surface. Initially, θ = 3 7 \theta =37^\circ and there is no slipping between the cylinder and stationary support. Now, the system is released from rest.

What is the normal force ( ( in N ) \text{N}) acting between the cylinder and the plank just after the release?

Take g = 9.8 m/s 2 . g=9.8\text{ m/s}^2.

10 20 30 40

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2 solutions

Mark Hennings
Jan 15, 2018

The distance between the blocks is x = 2 R cos θ x = 2R\cos\theta , and hence x ˙ = 2 R sin θ θ ˙ x ¨ = 2 R sin θ θ ¨ 2 R cos θ θ ˙ 2 \dot{x} \; = \; -2R\sin\theta \dot{\theta} \hspace{2cm} \ddot{x} \; = \; -2R\sin\theta \ddot{\theta} - 2R\cos\theta \dot{\theta}^2 The kinetic energy of the plank is 1 2 m x ˙ 2 \tfrac12m\dot{x}^2 . Since the moment of inertia of the cylinder about the point of contact with the rough block is 1 2 m R 2 + m R 2 = 3 2 m R 2 \tfrac12mR^2 + mR^2 = \tfrac32mR^2 , the kinetic energy of the cylinder is 3 4 m R 2 θ ˙ 2 \tfrac34mR^2\dot{\theta}^2 . Thus conservation of energy tells us that 1 2 m x ˙ 2 + 3 4 m R 2 θ ˙ 2 + m g R sin θ = m g R sin θ 0 \tfrac12m\dot{x}^2 + \tfrac34mR^2\dot{\theta}^2 + mgR\sin\theta \; = \; mgR\sin\theta_0 and hence ( 3 + 8 sin 2 θ ) θ ˙ 2 = 4 g R ( sin θ 0 sin θ ) (3 + 8\sin^2\theta)\dot{\theta}^2 \; =\; \tfrac{4g}{R}(\sin\theta_0 - \sin\theta) where θ 0 = 3 7 \theta_0 = 37^\circ is the original angle. Thus 2 ( 3 + 8 sin 2 θ ) θ ¨ + 16 sin θ cos θ θ ˙ 2 = 4 g R cos θ 2(3 + 8\sin^2\theta)\ddot{\theta} + 16\sin\theta \cos\theta \dot{\theta}^2 \; = \; -\tfrac{4g}{R}\cos\theta Initially we have θ = θ 0 \theta = \theta_0 , θ ˙ = 0 \dot{\theta} = 0 , and hence θ ¨ = 2 g cos θ 0 R ( 3 + 8 sin 2 θ 0 ) x ¨ = 4 g sin θ 0 cos θ 0 3 + 8 sin 2 θ 0 \ddot{\theta} \; = \; -\frac{2g\cos\theta_0}{R(3 + 8\sin^2\theta_0)} \hspace{2cm} \ddot{x} \; = \; \frac{4g\sin\theta_0\cos\theta_0}{3 + 8 \sin^2\theta_0} initially. Since m x ¨ = N cos θ 0 m\ddot{x} = N\cos\theta_0 , where N N is the normal reaction between the smooth plank and the cylinder, we see that the initial value of N N is 4 m g sin θ 0 3 + 8 sin 2 θ 0 = 20.00 \frac{4mg\sin\theta_0}{3 + 8\sin^2\theta_0} \; = \; 20.00 making the answer 20 N \boxed{20\; \mathrm{N}} .

How did you compute the moment of inertia of the cylinder?

Jacob Spear - 3 years, 4 months ago

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The moment of inertia of a uniform solid cylinder about its axis is 1 2 m R 2 \frac{1}{2} mR^2 . It is the same as the moment of inertia of a uniform flat disc about an axis passing through the center and perpendicular to the disc.

To find the moment of inertia about the axis passing through the point of contact, the parallel axis theorem is used

I = I c m + m d 2 I = I_{cm} + md^2

Here the axis passing through the point of contact is at distance R R from the axis passing through the center of mass, so I = 1 2 m R 2 + m R 2 I = \frac{1}{2} mR^2 + mR^2 .

Pranshu Gaba - 3 years, 4 months ago

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As it is made up of several discs, The Moment of inertia of both should be same. Isnt it?

Md Zuhair - 3 years, 2 months ago

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@Md Zuhair Yes, the moment of inertia of both are the same.

Pranshu Gaba - 3 years, 2 months ago

The weight of the cylinder acts equally due to symmetry through its contacts with the two planks, i.e. vertical force of 2.5g. Which converts to a normal force of 2.5g/sin(37) ~=40. That was my wrong thinking.

Desmond Campbell - 3 years, 4 months ago

I was about to ask: Why does it matter that one support will move? We have just released the cylinder so nothing is moving yet.
However, the fact is the plank will move because it isn't pushing back as hard as the fixed side. That explains why 24.5/cos(37)=30.7 is too big.

Jeremy Galvagni - 3 years, 4 months ago

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Nothing is moving, but both the cylinder and the smooth plank are accelerating.

Mark Hennings - 3 years, 4 months ago
Robin Karle
Jan 18, 2018

5kg * 10 m/s = 50N
37 is roughly 40 = 0.4
50N * 0.4 = 20N

Sry for no format at all it didn't work :(

Are you high?

Saman Rai - 3 years, 4 months ago

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Seems so :-P . Quite High.

Md Zuhair - 3 years, 2 months ago

Are you serious:)...

Jeff Smith - 3 years, 4 months ago

I used the tangent method, so Tan(37) is roughly .75. So opp/adj means opp vector (acting down) is doing 3/7 the work, and adjacent vector is 4/7. 5kg * 9.8m/s^2 = 49N. So the downward vector is acting 21N downwards.

Justin Blanding - 3 years, 4 months ago

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If that method was correct...i dont see where you divided by 2 due to equal forces acting on the stationary block

Mark Brown - 3 years, 4 months ago

Right answer for the wrong reasons

Mark Brown - 3 years, 4 months ago

We are at the point where physicists make similar approximations to engineers lol

André Hucek - 3 years, 4 months ago

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