3 − 5
Which one of these choices is equivalent to the expression above?
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Yes correct, it's pretty obvious the expression in question is negative while the choices are all positive in value. Bonus question: What is the minimal degree polynomial f with integer coefficients such that it has root 3 − 5 ?
For example, if x = 3 is a root of the polynomial g , then g ( x ) = x 2 − 3 .
But I did it like this
3 − 5 = ( 3 − 5 ) 2 = 8 − 2 1 5
Why doesn't it tally with the original value?Please help!
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x 2 = ∣ x ∣ , you are converting the negative value to a positive value which is the reason of error.
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thanks! @Rohit Ner
Thanks! @Rohit Ner
Not true. Because x%(2/2) will give us both the +ve and the -ve values of x.
|x| isnt true, because √x² can be negative or positive
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@Farhan Hafiz – Actually, no, the square root function never has a negative value. Tack on a plus-or-minus on the front and that's different.
The question itself gave the answer away. You just made a "Simplifying Error" ...
We knkw that it is imposaible to have a neative number in a square root so the answer should be none of the choices.
Because the original value is negative. Squaring and rooting would remove the negativity, so the correct answer would be : - \sqrt{8 - 2\sqrt{15}}
That's correct! I did the same thing.
It's equivalent to − 8 − 2 1 5 .
One of the roots of 5 is negative, as is one of the roots of 3 . So both answer 1 and answer 2 are correct. If you want us to restrict the domain to nonnegative reals, you should really say so.
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You are correct.
Wrong. The square root symbol refers to the principal root ONLY. Thus, the square root of 4 is 2, not both 2 and -2.
(√3- √5 )^2 =(√(8-2√15) )^2 ∴ √3 - √5 = ± √(8-2√15)
this have contradiction with your other question...
@Brilliant Mathematics , the moderator note has the "positive" and "negative" mixed up in the first line. Please correct it. :)
No such eq. Exists
Challenge master's bonus question solution:
Let's assume that r is the root of such polynomial,hence:
r = 3 − 5 → r 2 = 8 − 2 1 5 → r 2 − 8 = − 2 1 5
r 4 + 6 4 − 1 6 r 2 = 3 0 → r 4 − 1 6 r 2 + 3 4 = 0
Hence the equation x 4 − 1 6 x 2 + 3 4 = 0 has at least one root which is 3 − 5
And of course it's degree is 4.
As for our dear challenge master's second bonus question:
By false assumption , suppose that 3 − 5 is rational.Hence it can be written the form of n m where m and n are coprime integers.Now we know that if g c d ( m , n ) = 1 → g c d ( m 2 , n 2 ) = 1 hence , ,let n 2 m 2 = q p where g c d ( p , q ) = 1 thus, we have:
q 2 p 2 − 1 6 q p = − 3 4 → q 2 p 2 q − 1 6 p q 2 = − 3 4
→ q 2 ( p q ) ( p − 1 6 q ) = − 3 4 → q ( p ) ( p − 1 6 q ) = − 3 4
→ q ∣ p ∨ q ∣ p − 1 6 q
Case 1:if q ∣ p
Directly contradicts our assumption of g c d ( p , q ) = 1
Case 2: if q ∣ p − 1 6 q
q ∣ p − 1 6 q
q ∣ 1 6 q
⇒ q ∣ p − 1 6 q + 1 6 q → q ∣ p
Which is again also a contradiction.
Hence 3 − 5 is indeed irrational.
Bonus question: With this polynomial, can you prove that 3 − 5 is irrational?
Addendum: I was thinking of Rational Root Theorem (RRT) but the downside of RRT is that you need to go through the labor of computation. Well done.
One thing... i think this problem has a flawed answer.
{root(3) }^2 + {root(5)}^2 - 2 * root (3) * root(5) = {root (3) - root (5)} ^2
=> 8 - 2* root(15) = {root (3) - root (5)} ^2 ............... @Paul Rayan Longhas
I also think there was a mistake squaring the equation r^2 - 8 = -2sqrt(15). The square of the RHS is 4*15 = 60, not 30. The final equation should be x^4 -16x^2 + 4=0.
What I did was square the entire term. That's it.
If you square the entire term then you have to bring square root.From that view point solving the equation, option (a) should be correct
Why option A is wrong?
What on earth does "you have to bring square root" mean? What store can I buy "square root" at? And "square root" of what is intended? Please strive for CLARITY in remarks and explanations???
There was a mistake in squaring r 2-8. Final equation is x 4-16x*2+4=0
why can't it be A? Squaring the entire term and taking square root over it would give A
Right answer: square root of 3 - square root of 5
Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't the sqrt(3) both positive and negative?
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I answered 'B', just as I gather you have done, and was informed that I was stumped. Apparently Brilliant has decided the radical sign also implies absolute value. That isn't universally accepted.
in your working @ Joe Potillor, the sqrt of 4 is required
Why the answer is not 1st one as, Let, √3 - √5 = x x² = 8 - 2√15 x = √( 8 - 2√15 ) √3 - √5 = √( 8 - 2√15 )
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numerically √3 - √5 = 1.732-2.236 = -0.504 numerically √( 8 - 2√15 ) = +- 0.504 ie 1 root = -0.504 so why is √( 8 - 2√15 ) not correct?
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I think it is because √a indicates only the positive root of a while -√a indicates the negative root. This illustrates for me the importance of remembering that a^2 = b^2 does not directly imply a = b.
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The quantity given is negative while all of the numerical answer choices are positive.