Slip Less!

Find the minimum static coefficient of friction μ s \mu_s between a rod and the surface so that the rod, which when released from rest does not slip at the instant it is released.

Note: the rod is released from rest inclined at an angle θ = 6 0 \theta =60^\circ .


The answer is 0.3997.

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2 solutions

Kishore S. Shenoy
Sep 20, 2015

Taking Torque about A,

τ = m g l 2 cos θ = m l 2 3 α \displaystyle\tau = mg\dfrac{l}{2}\cos\theta = \dfrac{ml^2}{3}\alpha

α = 3 g cos θ 2 l = 3 g 4 l \displaystyle\begin{aligned}\Rightarrow \alpha &= \dfrac{3g\cos\theta}{2l}\\ &=\dfrac{3g}{4l}\end{aligned}

α = 3 g 4 l ( 1 ) \alpha = \dfrac{3g}{4l} \cdots(1)

Taking Forces at Centre of Mass, (since forces act on the centre of mass)

Acceleration of centre of mass is perpendicular to the rod because it is performing a pure rotation about the point of contact. a = α × r \vec{a} =\vec{\alpha} \times \vec{r}

m α l 2 cos θ = m g N ( 1 ) 3 m g 16 = 16 m g 16 N N = 13 m g 16 \displaystyle\begin{aligned}m\alpha \dfrac{l}{2}\cos\theta &= mg - \mathbb{N}\\(1)\Rightarrow \dfrac{3mg}{16} &= \dfrac{16mg}{16} - \mathbb{N}\\ \mathbb{N}&=\dfrac{13mg}{16}\end{aligned}

Applying F = m a F=ma for the horizontal forces:

μ N = m α l sin θ 2 i.e μ 13 16 m g = 3 3 16 m g \displaystyle\begin{aligned}\mu \mathbb{N} &= \dfrac{m\alpha l\sin\theta}{2}\\ \text{i.e }\mu\dfrac{13}{16}mg &= \dfrac{3\sqrt{3}}{16}mg\end{aligned}

μ s = 3 3 13 0.3997 \displaystyle\Rightarrow \boxed{\mu_s = \dfrac{3\sqrt{3}}{13}} \approx 0.3997\\

Moderator note:

This is an exceptional solution. Your diagrams are very clear and your argument is as concise as it gets.

yea.. did it in d same way..

Sriram Vudayagiri - 5 years, 8 months ago

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this question i found in my package

Akash singh - 5 years, 8 months ago

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It is there! Rotational Mechanics Phase 3

Kishore S. Shenoy - 5 years, 8 months ago

Oh really... well.. good then!

Sriram Vudayagiri - 5 years, 8 months ago

Some doubt,

Let there be a mass m m on the rod and the coefficient of friction be μ \mu . The acceleration towards the ground would be m g sin 6 0 o mg\sin{60^{o}} and frictional force be μ m g cos 6 0 o \mu mg\cos{60^{o}} . I think to minimize slipping acceleration should be 0 0 . Thus giving μ = tan 6 0 o = 1.732 \mu = \tan{60^{o}} =1.732

Department 8 - 5 years, 8 months ago

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typo.. acceleration should be g sin60. Anyways.. can u tell me y it should be so? You dont know the value of N and without that how would u calculate acceleration of COM of the rod, except for writing torque equation...

Sriram Vudayagiri - 5 years, 8 months ago

first of all normal reaction wouldnt be mg cos60,it would be mg

Kaustubh Miglani - 5 years, 8 months ago

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No, it would not because it has a downward acceleration.

Kishore S. Shenoy - 5 years, 8 months ago

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@Kishore S. Shenoy N always acts perpendicular to the surface.therefore it should be mg. yhowever as the rod does not move..

Kaustubh Miglani - 5 years, 8 months ago

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@Kaustubh Miglani No. See this :

The Normal N \mathbb{N} acts on the centre of mass. You know that the centre of mass is moving downward also. If, as you said, N = m g \mathbb{N} = mg , then the cenre of mass sould not move down, which is wrong. Thus N < m g \mathbb{N}<mg .

Kishore S. Shenoy - 5 years, 8 months ago

No. You can't just predict that. You have to first consider it as N N

Kishore S. Shenoy - 5 years, 8 months ago

Could you please tell me how you got the force l 2 α \dfrac{l}{2}\alpha on the COM and what force it is?

User 123 - 5 years, 8 months ago

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Since the rod is rotating about the contact point with α \alpha angular acceleration, the net force acting on the centre is length from axis × α = l 2 α \text{{length from axis}} \times \alpha = \dfrac{l}{2} \alpha

Kishore S. Shenoy - 5 years, 8 months ago

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Sorry, but I still didn't understand. Why should the force acting be l e n g t h length x α \alpha ? Could you please explain how you got it? Sorry for the doubt, but I've just started learning Rotation and am quite confused.

User 123 - 5 years, 8 months ago

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@User 123 See. The basic definition of radians is that Radius × Angle = Arc Length \text{Radius}\times \text{Angle} = \text{Arc Length} . Differentiating twice, Radius × α = a [ linear ] \text{Radius}\times\alpha = a~~\left[\text{linear}\right]

So here, at centre of mass which is at a distance l 2 \dfrac{l}{2} from the point of contact, linear acceleration is

[ Linear ] a = l 2 α \left[\text{Linear}\right]a = \dfrac{l}{2}\alpha

Hope you understand! Do ask if any doubts occur! Well I'm also studying rotation right now! It's in Phase 3. You're in FIITJEE right?

Kishore S. Shenoy - 5 years, 8 months ago

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@Kishore S. Shenoy Yeah, I understood. Thanks very very much! Actually I had forgotten that r ω = v r\omega=v and r α = a r\alpha=a ! Yes, but we're still in Phase 2 and have just started COM. By the way, Rotation is the last chapter of Phase 2 for us.

User 123 - 5 years, 8 months ago

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@User 123 Oh is it! We're now Phase 3 right now.

Kishore S. Shenoy - 5 years, 8 months ago

@Kishore S. Shenoy Hey..im A FIITJEE student as welll... Chennai Kilpauk Centre

Sriram Vudayagiri - 5 years, 8 months ago

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@Sriram Vudayagiri Great! Hello to you!

Kishore S. Shenoy - 5 years, 8 months ago

@Kishore S. Shenoy One last doubt please. What is causing the force on the C M CM ? Is it friction?

User 123 - 5 years, 8 months ago

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@User 123 @Ishan Dasgupta Samarendra When I took accelerations of centre of mass, I am taking it w.r.t ground. Hence we can consider N \mathbb{N} to be acting at C M CM . But if we are taking w.r.t any point on the system, we have to consider τ \tau torques only (including that due to pseudo forces, that act at CM). If we consider any point on the rod, we get no solution. So I used linear system.

Kishore S. Shenoy - 5 years, 8 months ago

@User 123 @Ishan Dasgupta Samarendra When I took accelerations of centre of mass, I am taking it w.r.t ground. Hence we can consider N \mathbb{N} to be acting at C M CM . But if we are taking w.r.t any point on the system, we have to consider τ \tau torques only (including that due to pseudo forces, that act at CM). If we consider any point on the rod, we get no solution. So I used linear system.

Kishore S. Shenoy - 5 years, 8 months ago

Well @Ishan Dasgupta Samarendra , In rotation, for a body undergoing general plane motion, you can always assume a body to TRANSLATE with some VELOCITY and ACCELERATION and ROTATE about a particular point with some ANGULAR VELOCITY and ANGULAR ACCELERATION. Now for any other point on the body the velocity and acceleration is given as the vector sum of TRANSLATION and ROTATION part.

Hope that it helps

Mayank Singh - 5 years, 8 months ago

How did you solve it. Any other method? Please Share.

Kishore S. Shenoy - 5 years, 8 months ago

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Alright, but later. My exams are going on and my method was quite tedious.

User 123 - 5 years, 8 months ago

I do not still understand what you mean in Collisions Galore! . 10 t h ^{th} means that between wall and ball right?

Kishore S. Shenoy - 5 years, 8 months ago

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10th collision between the ball and the block. Hope you like the problem:)

User 123 - 5 years, 8 months ago

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@User 123 Only considering the collisions b/w the block and ball? That calculation is tough! There should be some easy method!

Kishore S. Shenoy - 5 years, 8 months ago

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@Kishore S. Shenoy Yeah. Well, hopefully you'll come up with one!

User 123 - 5 years, 8 months ago

You must specify the direction of acceleration of the rod's COM. By what I mean that you need to tell why rod's COM will have acceleration normal to the rod. Actually, I am saying so because it took me quite a time to get the direction. :P I was messing around with hazard(a lot of puns, hint:football).

Kartik Sharma - 5 years, 8 months ago

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Normal to the rod. Not surface

Kishore S. Shenoy - 5 years, 8 months ago

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Yeah sorry. Actually I meant normal to the surface of the rod. It has become so usual to say "normal to the surface". That's why I got it. Edited!

Kartik Sharma - 5 years, 8 months ago

But the application point of friction is at the bottom so why did you consider its torque???(at COM) Plz clarify my doubt... @Kishore S Shenoy

Sarthak Behera - 5 years, 7 months ago

How are you so awesome in physics, Can you please suggest me some tips for physics problem solving?

Thanks!

Harsh Shrivastava - 4 years, 9 months ago

Could someone please point out the mistake in my reasoning?

The acceleration of the bottom end of the rod is 0. So forces are in equilibrium. The forces are tension, T, from the rod, friction, f and the normal force, N.

Resolving forces vertically: N = ( 3 / 2 ) T N=(\sqrt{3}/2) T . Resolving forces horizontally: f = ( 1 / 2 ) T f=(1/2) T .

Therefore N = 3 f N=\sqrt{3} f , so μ 1 / 3 \mu \geq 1/\sqrt{3}

Joe Mansley - 2 months, 2 weeks ago

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Forces act at the centre of mass rather than any other point. To elaborate this, consider a ring of mass in the vertical plane, i.e. its axis is parallel to the ground, and is touching the ground at exactly one point. Now, we push the topmost point of the ring to gently make it roll about its own axis. We know that the lowermost point will not slip, but the net force on the lowermost point is the frictional force. This contradicts Newton's Second Law. This is because forces act at the centre of mass of the body when we consider net forces. The geometry of the object plays a role in angular mechanics only. At the centre of mass, the force we provide to roll the ring counteracts the frictional force and Newton smiles in his grave. Hope this helped!

Kishore S. Shenoy - 1 month, 1 week ago

I think I see my mistake. The internal forces in the rod need not be parallel to the rod.

Joe Mansley - 1 month ago

There is a serious mistake.While writing the equation for vertical motion you just took the component of tangential acceleration along vertical direction and missed out the component of normal acceleration along vertical direction.Please see this carefully https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0igjzb5JSLE.

A Former Brilliant Member - 5 years, 5 months ago

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There! I got it! The question asks about and only about the instant when it starts rotation. There ω = 0 \omega=0 .

Kishore S. Shenoy - 5 years, 5 months ago

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Clever boy :-D.I did'nt notice that "instant" part.How one word can change so many things :-P!

A Former Brilliant Member - 5 years, 5 months ago

But please modify the question saying it is released at 60 degrees angle...

A Former Brilliant Member - 5 years, 5 months ago

Can you explain where? I did not understand what you meant... ☺

Kishore S. Shenoy - 5 years, 5 months ago

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You did'nt consider the component of centripetal acceleration in y direction.You just took tangential acceleration.Check the video I linked.

A Former Brilliant Member - 5 years, 5 months ago
Shashank Goel
Sep 21, 2015

For a general theta i found the solution as u=3sinx.cosx/(1+3sin^2(x)) where x=theta.

Great! I never thought of it.

Kishore S. Shenoy - 5 years, 8 months ago

Seems nice. Put x=90 . Another good part.

Nivedit Jain - 3 years, 3 months ago

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