Tired superman

One fateful day, a car with weight 5000 N 5000~\mbox{N} has malfunctioned on the entry ramp to a highway. It is now sliding down the ramp, angled at 3 0 30^\circ with respect to the horizontal. The coefficients (static and kinetic) of friction are 0.4 0.4 . Then, Superman comes and saves the day! However, he just had a fight with the bad guys so he wants to use the least amount of force as possible. First, he uses the minimum amount of force to stop the car. Then, he uses the minimum amount of force to push the car so it starts sliding slightly upward along the ramp. What is the absolute value of the difference between the two forces he uses in Newtons ?

Details and assumptions

  • Answer to the nearest integer.
  • Assume the force is directed along the ramp.
  • Submitted by Christopher B.


The answer is 3464.

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8 solutions

We know the following to be true with respect to the block:
F g = m g sin θ Fg_\parallel = mg \sin\theta and F g = m g cos θ Fg_\perp = mg\cos\theta

With some simply geometry, we find that the inclination of the ramp to the vertical is equal to the angle that the force of gravity makes with the normal force.
We find that F = m g cos ( 30 ) = 5000 cos ( 30 ) = 4330 N e w t o n s F_\perp = mg\cos(30) = 5000\cos(30) = 4330 Newtons
Knowing that F f = F × μ = 4330 × 0.4 = 1732 N e w t o n s F_f = F_\perp \times \mu = 4330 \times 0.4 = 1732 Newtons

Now, it seems tempting to find F g Fg_\parallel but it is not actually needed.

Notice:
The Force Needed to Stop the Car _ = F g F f Fg_\parallel - F_f because friction helps stop the car.
_
The Force Needed to Move the Car
= F g + F f Fg_\parallel + F_f because friction stops the car from moving upwards.
The question asks for the difference, and after subtracting these two equations we find that the answer is:
2 × F f = 2 × 1732 = 3464 N e w t o n s . 2 \times F_f = 2 \times 1732 = \boxed{3464 Newtons.}

Thank you

AAditya Barot - 7 years, 5 months ago
Jonathon Capps
Aug 12, 2013

A force diagram helps to keep everything straight on this one.

F s t o p = F g sin θ F F F_{stop} = F_g \sin \theta - F_F

F m o v e = F g sin θ + F F F_{move} = F_g \sin \theta + F_F

F F = μ F N = μ F g cos θ = 0.4 F g cos 30 F_F = \mu F_N = \mu F_g \cos \theta = 0.4 F_g \cos 30

F m o v e F s t o p = 2 F F = 2 0.4 5000 cos 30 = 3464 |F_{move} - F_{stop}| = |2 F_F| = |2 * 0.4 *5000 \cos 30| = 3464

Moderator note:

On these solutions the force is assumed to be parallel to the ramp. In the original problem statement this was not mentioned explicitly, which I fixed. Someone did the problem allowing the angle to vary. Can anyone give me the ABSOLUTE minimum force required to push the car up the ramp, allowing the angle to vary?

Reply to the challenge master's Question

The absolute minimum force is calculated when superman applies force at an angle with the incline

Yeah!!! The actual answer according to me was 3216.337 N 3216.337N ! I was completely baffled when it said that I was wrong! When I saw this question, no user had solved it and so I was quite happy that I would be the first one to solve it! According to me,the first force was

5 29 ( 2500 1000 3 ) \frac {5} {\sqrt{29}} * (2500 - 1000*\sqrt{3} )

and the second force was

5 29 ( 2500 + 1000 3 ) \frac {5} {\sqrt{29}} * (2500 + 1000*\sqrt{3} )

and thus the difference = 10000 3 29 10000 * \frac {\sqrt{3}} {\sqrt{29}} = 3216.337 N = 3216.337 N

I spent two days thinking over what I had done wrong when I decided to go with the obvious(but wrong!) answer,where we apply force parallel to the incline. I still don't know why 3460 is being given the correct answer.

Is my answer correct?

PS - I am sorry Jonathan C. that I posted my view on your solution, but the challenge master asked the solution here so I gave it.

Siddharth Brahmbhatt - 7 years, 10 months ago

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Force is applied parallel itself,its not wrong

Pranay Rao - 7 years, 10 months ago

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Well but when I saw the question, it wasn't mentioned. The line 'Assume the force is directed along the ramp' was added afterwards.

Siddharth Brahmbhatt - 7 years, 10 months ago

Sorry for this too late reaction but for what is 5/V29 number?

Hafizh Ahsan Permana - 7 years, 2 months ago

Now I'm confused why I keep getting 3464 instead of 3460, which I got the first time it it says the answer is.

Jonathon Capps - 7 years, 10 months ago

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I'm pretty sure the answer is 3464. 3460 is just due to rounding.

Ricky Escobar - 7 years, 10 months ago
Tim Vermeulen
Aug 13, 2013

F normal = 5000 cos ( 3 0 ) = 2500 3 N , F_{\text{normal}} = 5000 \cdot \cos(30^{\circ}) = 2500\sqrt{3} N,

so the friction is

0.4 2500 3 = 1000 3 N . 0.4 \cdot 2500\sqrt{3} = 1000\sqrt{3} N.

The difference in force of stopping the car and pushing it back up is the friction: when stopping the car, the friction helps you, while when pushing the car up, the friction is working against you. So, the difference we're looking for is twice the friction, which is

2 1000 3 3460 . 2 \cdot 1000\sqrt{3} \approx \boxed{3460}.

Where does the mgsinθ come in? Could you explain it further?

Alex Benfield - 7 years, 10 months ago

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Whether stopping the car or pushing the car up, you have to apply the 5000 sin θ 5000 \sin \theta force. So when you subtract the stopping requirement from the pushing requirement, this cancels out.

Matt McNabb - 7 years, 9 months ago
Cody Martin
Aug 13, 2013

Minimum force required to prevent car from sliding= = m g ( sin θ μ cos θ ) =mg(\sin \theta-\mu \cos \theta) = 5000 ( 1 2 0.4 3 2 ) = 2500 1000 3 =5000(\frac{ 1 }{ 2 }-0.4*\frac{ \sqrt{3} }{ 2 })=2500-1000\sqrt{3} Minimum force required to just push it up the incline= = m g ( sin θ + μ cos θ ) =mg(\sin \theta +\mu \cos \theta) = 2500 + 1000 3 =2500+1000\sqrt{3} so the difference is coming out to be 2000 3 = 3464 2000\sqrt{3}=3464

Mahesh Raj
Dec 27, 2013

mass of the car comes out to be 500 kg taking G=10..Firstly we need to calculate the force which our superman is needed to exert on the car that and for that we will have to resolve the component towards superman and that is {mg \times (\sin \theta)} - (4/10) {mg \times (\cos \theta)} . lets now get the force which superman must apply it comes out to be
{mg \times (\sin \theta)} + (4/10)
{mg \times (\cos \theta)}. when we subtract we get 2(4/10)*{mg \times (\cos \theta)} putting values i get 3460.000

  • a moment before the car sliding down:

F = m a = 0 ∑F = ma = 0

F 1 + f W s i n 3 0 0 = 0 F_{1} + f - W sin 30^{0} = 0

F 1 = W s i n 3 0 0 µ W c o s 3 0 0 F_{1} = W sin 30^{0} - µ W cos 30^{0}

  • a moment the car starts sliding up:

F = m a = 0 ∑F = ma = 0

F 2 f W s i n 3 0 0 = 0 F_{2} - f - W sin 30^{0} = 0

F 2 = W s i n 3 0 0 + µ W c o s 3 0 0 F_{2} = W sin 30^{0} + µ W cos 30^{0}

then finally we'll have:

F 2 F 1 = 3464.102 N F_{2} - F_{1} = 3464.102 N

Abhijith Sriram
Dec 20, 2013

By using FBD we can find it initial force required will be equal to 5000 (sin30-.4 cos30) then the force required to push is 5000 (sin30+.4 cos30) thus difference will yield 3460N as the answer.

Nhat Le
Aug 12, 2013

When superman stops the car, consider the free-body diagram of the car. We have 4 forces: weight of the car W W , normal contact force N N , friction (which acts up the slope) f = μ N f=\mu N , and superman's force F 1 F_1

Resolving the forces perpendicular to the slope would give us N = W cos 3 0 N=W\cos30^\circ , therefore f = μ W cos 3 0 f=\mu W\cos30^\circ

Resolving the forces parallel to the slope would give us F 1 = W sin 3 0 f F_1 = W\sin30^\circ-f

Now, in the case when superman pushes the car with the force F 2 F_2 so that it starts to move upwards, the frictional force f f , which still has the same magnitude, now acts down the slope. Therefore, resolving the forces parallel to the slope gives us F 2 = W sin 3 0 + f F_2 = W\sin30^\circ+f

The difference between F 1 F_1 and F 2 F_2 is thus equal to 2 f = 2 μ W cos 3 0 = 3460 N 2f = 2\mu W\cos30^\circ = 3460N

shouldn't N be Nsin30?

Phalguni Shah - 7 years, 10 months ago

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No, N = W cos 3 0 N = W\cos30^\circ . N N acts perpendicular to the slope while W W acts directly downwards. If you resolve the forces perpendicular to the slope, you will get N = W cos 3 0 N = W\cos30^\circ

Nhat Le - 7 years, 10 months ago

I don't quite understand why you need to find the difference between F1 and F2?

Alex Benfield - 7 years, 10 months ago

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The question asks for the difference between the two forces

Nhat Le - 7 years, 10 months ago

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Ok, I am an idiot.... Haha I did not read the question right!!!

Alex Benfield - 7 years, 10 months ago

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@Alex Benfield Haha no worries!

Nhat Le - 7 years, 10 months ago

are you serius about the diffrence?

2 f = 2 μ W c o s 30 = 3460 N 2f=2μWcos30∘=3460N

2 f = 2 0 , 4 5000 c o s 30 = 3464 N 2f=2*0,4*5000cos30=3464N

how did you say 3460 ?

Hafizh Ahsan Permana - 7 years, 9 months ago

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Haha yeah it should be 3464. I followed Brilliant's solution, which says 3460. I think they round it down to 3 significant figures

Nhat Le - 7 years, 9 months ago

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